***** This thread is now closed, please CLICK HERE to go to Volume 4 *****
As the title suggests, a place to discuss Formula One, and all other types of motorsport (excluding MotoGP, which has a section of its own).
PLEASE NOTE:-
To try and maintain some kind of logical order of discussion, if you start a new subject then reply to this post and remember to change the default subject header.
Last edited by: VxFan on Sun 27 Jun 10 at 19:30
|
(moved from vol 2)
>> >> .............. there are two last lap scenarios involving the safety car.
>>
>> Show me the rule about the two last lap scenarios? I wil show th erule
>> that covers the last lap, but I dont see an Ah But! rule?
>>
The race didn't finish under the safety car. The official F1 website says so. Link in this post
goo.gl/TSJ3
Last edited by: VxFan on Wed 26 May 10 at 10:29
|
Yes, that link says "With the track declared clear and the safety car coming in", as it was the last lap the safety car would have also come in had the track not been declared clear which is how the stewards wrongly interpreted it.
However the stewards decision cannot be reversed! Altogether unfair on Schu and MB and lucky for Alonso and Ferrari.
|
|
I give up, you clearly dont know what last lap means. Just to amuse you I will accept the last 100 yards of the track was another lap.
|
>> I give up, you clearly dont know what last lap means. >>
Are you being deliberately obtuse RF?
There are two possible last lap scenarios:
1/ The SC enters the pits on the last lap before the end of the race and the track goes green so the race DOES NOT end under the SC.
2/ The SC enters the pits on the last lap before the end of the race and the track remains yellow so the race DOES end under the SC.
|
>> However the stewards decision cannot be reversed!
It could be if the team chose to appeal, but they didn't... as they knew that he was in the wrong!
|
>> >> However the stewards decision cannot be reversed!
>>
>> It could be if the team chose to appeal, but they didn't... >>
That is simply inaccurate, they could have appealed though there is no route to rescind a drive-through penalty (yes it was a retrospective drive-through) therefore they didnt appeal.
>> as they knew that he was in the wrong!
>>
As has been proven Schu was in the right and the stewrads erred.
|
I'm with RF on this but it's irrelevant. A drive through cannot be appealed so why do we keep debating this.
I wonder how Schuey will perform once they have adapted the car to his style of driving. I assume he'll then be faster than his teammate who seems to prefer the car as it is.
|
>>, they could have appealed
Glad you agree!
>>
>> As has been proven Schu was in the right and the stewrads erred.
>>
Link please?
(Preferably to an Official Site and not a Gossip one!)
Last edited by: hobby on Thu 27 May 10 at 10:33
|
The Offical F1 site has the following:
www.formula1.com/news/headlines/2010/5/10814.html
Note the use of the word "clarify", not "change".
I stand by what I said, he could have appealed it, but he didn't.
|
>> I stand by what I said, he could have appealed it, but he didn't.
>>
No, the team could have appealed though they decided not to, why? Because there is no process for the particular penalty that was awarded to be rescinded.
|
>> >>, they could have appealed
>>
>> Glad you agree!
>>
Quoted out of context :-(
|
>>
>> The race didn't finish under the safety car. The official F1 website says so. Link
>> in this post
>>
>> goo.gl/TSJ3
>>
It also says at www.formula1.com/termsandconditions.html
Our Obligations and Liabilities
Material in this Site may contain inaccuracies or typographical errors. We shall not be liable
|
I understand that the FIA are looking to review all their rules and are looking for someone who can give different interpretations of them so they can tighten up the wording to prevent any future issues...
I have suggested Mr Schumacher, Mr Hamilton, the Mercedes and McLaren teams and a Mr Cheddar could help them! :-)
|
If cheddar is making up the rule book it would be very short.
1/ If you car is red and comes from Northern Italy you can
a/ Do anything you want
b/ Be promoted to 1st place at every race.
2/ If your car is not red and does not come from northern italy
a/ you will always be in the wrong
b/ Be demoted at every race to allow 1b above.
3/ If you car is sliver and comes from North West Surrey
a/ dont bother turning up, you are wasting your time
b/ depost 50 million dollars into a secret fund every year for the use of the FIA
Last edited by: Zero on Fri 28 May 10 at 12:58
|
>> If cheddar is making up the rule book it would be very short.
>>
>> 2/ If your car is not red and does not come from northern italy
>>
Add
2/ c/ the ruules above (2a and 2b) do not apply if your name is Schumacher, as in that case you can do now wrong whatever colour car or team you are driving for. This is in recognition of the five titles won by Schumi for the team in red.
|
>> If cheddar is making up the rule book it would be very short.
>>
>> 1/ If you car is red and comes from Northern Italy you can
>>
>> a/ Do anything you want
b/ Be promoted to 1st place at every race.
>>
Hehe, funny though also tosh RF - so that is why I think Shu in the Silver MB should have kept the place in Monaco to Alonso in the red northern Italian Ferrari's detriment eh?
|
>> The race didn't finish under the safety car. The official F1 website says so. Link
>> in this post
Just because the official F1 website says something, it doesn't necessarily make it gospel.
Any statement is open to interpretation by a good lawyer.
|
>>Any statement is open to interpretation by a good lawyer.
Mrs Manatee:
"Your tea's ready".
Me:
"Is it actually ready, as in on the plate, accompanied by a cup of tea and a slice of buttered Mother's Pride and a napkin? Or is it just an imminent event, in which case your statement is inaccurate in all material respects, in breach of the warranties you gave in our 1977 Agreement pursuant to the Marriage Act of 1949?"
Mrs M:
"What? Do you want it or not? And it's granary with Trill on top and Flora, not that muck you like to poison yourself with. And if that's your attitude, you can make your own cup of tea and while you're at it I'll have one as well!"
Me:
"Attitude? Moi? Au contraire, we have just established that my tea is not in fact ready, and that I have been distracted from my crossword again for no good reason. I am right, you are wrong, and if you do not remedy this persistent breach of contract-AAARRRRRGGGGGHHHHH!!!!! YOU CAN'T DO THAT! WHAT HAVE I SAID? HOW AM I GOING TO GET ALL THIS SAUCE OUT OF MY SHIRT? COME BACK!!!!"
Last edited by: Manatee on Sat 29 May 10 at 08:47
|
He's getting closer... Schumacher qualifies 5th, 1:26.857 against Webber's 1:26.295 or about half of one percent difference, although of course we don't know how much is due to the mechanical bits
Nice little interview with MS in the BBC pre-qualifying build-up asking him about his Monaco manoeuvre - said he 'enjoyed' it, with a cheeky grin.
|
Did anyone else notice the closing seconds of BBC1's qualifying program?
"Webber takes poll"
Perhaps they took a vote on it. ;>)
It's there on i-player.
|
Did anyone notice the poster on an internet forum who doesn't know the difference between 'program' and 'programme'?
'Program' is a list of instructions for a computer, 'programme' is, among other things, a radio or television broadcast.
It's there on car4play. :)
|
>> Did anyone notice the poster on an internet forum who doesn't know the difference between
>> 'program' and 'programme'?
>>
>> 'Program' is a list of instructions for a computer, 'programme' is, among other things, a
>> radio or television broadcast.
>>
>> It's there on car4play. :)
Frankly, I dont care. What did this bring to a thread about Formula 1?
|
>> Frankly, I dont care. What did this bring to a thread about Formula 1?
>>
I'm saying nothing!
;-)
|
>>Did anyone notice the poster on an internet forum who doesn't know the difference between 'program' and 'programme'?
Your write, Aye should of noticed.
bt.
|
...Your write, Aye should of noticed...
Ho ho.
BT,
The cretin at the BBC is paid public money and should be a professional journalist.
You make no such claim because your area of expertise lies elsewhere.
Let's hope the race doesn't turn out to be another Turkey.
|
>> He's getting closer...
...and now in with a chance of a podium, thanks to the generosity of the Red Bull boys...
|
>> ...and now in with a chance of a podium, thanks to the generosity of the Red Bull boys...
Shame, only 4th - Webber got back up to his pre-crash pace and held on. More stuff going on than most races, with Hamilton and Button also looking like they wanted to take each other out at one point.
|
|
Is "critical for fuel" code for "behave yourselves"?
|
|
Holly smoke, there was some egos and testosterone on display today! Fabulous stuff!
|
All is not sweetness and light at McLaren anymore. Watching the body language and the press conference (Hamilton talking to Webber while Button was talking - a classic maginalisation) there is trouble in store.
I suspect that Hamilton is upset that Button jumped him, while he (Lewis) was saving fuel.
|
>> I suspect that Hamilton is upset that Button jumped him, while he (Lewis) was saving
>> fuel.
...although he was very diplomatic when speaking about it. But it certainly looked like he didn't enjoy spraying the champagne as much as he should have done.
|
England win because of two Japanese own goals, Hamilton and Button get 1st and 2nd because of two Red Bull own goals.
Maybe our luck's in?
|
|
Hmm Yes, maybe a fiver on the world cup would not be wasted.
|
What a great race, eventful anyway.
I hope we will now hear less about Jenson Button being outclassed by his teammate in the bumping and boring stakes. They were both outclassed here by little Vettel, but you would want to be wouldn't you? Robbed of his hat trick, Webber looked sour after the race, but he's still leading the championship and is well ahead of Vettel.
My favourite newcomer Kobayashi got his first point. 'Perseverance furthers'. I think he's quick and a racer, and the car is just starting to come to him (as they say). The Sauber is the most distinctive-looking car on the grid with that ungainly big tail fin giving it a breadvan profile. Sinister but rakish. I look on it with a kind eye.
|
>> They were both outclassed here by little Vettel,
IN the Richard Head stakes he is head of the class, yes.
|
>> IN the Richard Head stakes he is head of the class, yes.
Only temporarily, in a field of ambitious, striving 20-30 year old nutters. I sometimes feel Zero that you don't understand the material from which sporting heroes are made.
What a bunch of hairy little men though. I am lost in admiration.
|
Indeed I do, As per my Testosterone and Egos coment.
Vettel had the position, Had it been schumacher there at that time, Webber would have foundhimself gently herded out into the dirt and carp on the side of the track, and both would have continued, albiet with webber a place lower than he was.
Schumacher had an animal cunning and a ruthless streak, to match the talent and balls. And he was intelegent. I think vettel is a bit short in that department.
|
>> Schumacher had an animal cunning and a ruthless streak, to match the talent and balls.
>> And he was intelegent. I think vettel is a bit short in that department.
Another short interview with the man after today's race. To me he looks like he's enjoying himself, and still oozes (self) confidence. Definitely adds to the entertainment.
Speaking of entertainment, having seen more of the pre- and post-race stuff today than usual, I do like the BBC's threesome of anchor Jake whats-his-name along with DC and Eddy J. Jake has a dry sense of humour, and can handle situations (like Lewis's girlfriend's unscheduled interruption for a few words) without getting flustered. He can also gently rib DC, who is a useful source of driver point of view info (today it was 'how I handled the 3 times me and my team-mate took each other out'). And Eddy gives a team perspective. Nice work.
Last edited by: Focus on Sun 30 May 10 at 16:24
|
>> can handle situations (like Lewis's girlfriend's >> unscheduled interruption
I have never seen such a display of self centred attention seeking, what a dreadful girl.
|
>> what a dreadful girl.
I don't see how you really know that Zero. But she isn't very bright or at all cool. California through and through in fact. She should stick to jumping up and down and never speak.
|
>> >> what a dreadful girl.
>>California through and through in fact.>>
Is California the USA's Essex?
|
|
I found it very refreshing to see the modesty and calmness of the leading drivers at the end of the race. It's many a long year since I've seen such control, and I hope it continues in the future.
|
|
That wasnt modesty and calmness. That was stony silence before two *very* big rows brewing in two places.
|
>> That wasnt modesty and calmness. That was stony silence before two *very* big rows brewing
>> in two places.
>>
I was referring to the modest waving during the cooling down lap, in place of the childishly frantic air punching of the last few years.
|
|
yeah, the row started brewing well before the finish.
|
>> I was referring to the modest waving during the cooling down lap, in place of
>> the childishly frantic air punching of the last few years.
Lewis was still upset about Button's attempt to get past I think, Button was perhaps feeling a bit guilty, and Webber was somewhat annoyed about not coming 1st.
|
Well worth watching, best race so far and its great that Reb Bull seem to have a direct rival for pace now, it makes it more more interesting.
Well worthy of note was just how sharp the front end in slow corners on the McLaren looks compared to the RB. The RBs do look mighty planted in the high speed stuff though.
|
...I was referring to the modest waving...
That wasn't waving, that was shaking of fists, bring it on!
|
Yay!
My tickets for the GP arrived!
|
I see that Ferarri have extended Massa's contract until the end of 2012, good news, he deserved to win the championship in '08 and did not deserve the injury sustained last year, it is great that they have shown faith in him, he is one of the nice guys.
|
I've just noticed my Sky+ didn't automatically series link for Saturday's qualifying; it has only set itself up for the race on Sunday.
If you're also with Sky then it might be worth checking your planner to see if the same has occurred to you.
For reference, Saturday qualifying is on BBC2 at 17:00.
|
|
I went to set up F1 recording earlier on Sky and it didn't offer series link for the qualifying but did for the race. So if anyone is interested they need to set a recording (which won't be series linked) for qualifying.
|
|
Do you have to set up each race separately on Sky? If so, that's a bit naff. I think V+ just records all F1 programmes, now it's a favourite or whatever they are called. And TiVo with it's older interface does an even better job of series recording.
|
>> Do you have to set up each race separately on Sky?
No, you can series link it, but the planner has only set itself up for the race on Sunday and not Saturday qualifying like it usually does - hence the message for people who have Sky to check their planners.
|
|
V+ has done this before. It's because they switched the qualifying to BBC2 and series links only look for programmes on the channel you set them for. That's how V+ used to work for me anyway.
|
|
Yes, maybe you're right about V+. Just set the Le Mans 24 on TiVo for a season pass and it got them all, despite constant switching between Eurosport 1 and 2 (or GB or whatever it is). I remember reading somewhere how linking worked for TiVo and it's not that tricky. It's just down to whoever writes the guide data to put teh right info in!
|
I tried the V+ box at our sons earlier. You couldn't set a series link for todays qualifying just record it. So the TV schedules do not have the series info. TIVO probably is more intelligent and has been around for ages.
Sky+ HD boxes won't even let you do series links until the box has downloaded the TV programmes info.
|
Just a reminder that Le Mans is on this weekend. The Peugeots wiped the Audis out of the first two rows of the grid for a change, but the race is much more about reliability than grid position.
Eurosport are covering the whole race which starts at 15:00 European time (14:00 here) and finishes...err...24 hours later.
|
|
Sky News has just said that Nigel Mansell has had an accident at Le Mans and has been helicoptered off to hospital with leg injuries..which must mean he doesn't waste any time as the race hadn't even been going long (they are an hour ahead I think).
Last edited by: Westpig on Sat 12 Jun 10 at 15:07
|
Former Formula One world champion Nigel Mansell has crashed at the 24 Hours of Le Mans.
Mansell spun around in his Ginetta-Zytek and hit the security barrier before the Indianapolis turn, just 18 minutes after the race started Saturday.
The 56-year-old British driver was racing for the first time at Le Mans, with his sons Greg and Leo. He appeared conscious as he was evacuated in an ambulance.
Peugeot took an early lead with its cars holding on the four top positions before the safety car entered the 13.6-kilometer circuit de la Sarthe.
|
His son said a bit back that nothing was broken. There was a discussion on my other forum about betting on LM, and someone discussed placing a bet on him going off the track and a subsequent poster said they gave him more than 18 minutes. Spooky, as that was days ago.
No official cause yet, commentators (esp Johnny Herbert, who I respect) thought it was a rear blow out at about 2000 mph TV didn't capture the actual event, just the subsequent spin and the second hit on the barriers, which didn't look that bad.
Last edited by: smokie on Sat 12 Jun 10 at 17:29
|
Well what a blinding result for Audi. There were four Peugeots which were faster than them, and they all dropped out for various reasons, leaving an Audi 1 - 2 - 3. You couldn't have predicted that.
One of the best sporting moments of the race was when the Peugeot boss, who had previously been seen in tears at hos team's failure, went to the Audi garage with 20 minutes to go to shake the hand of the good Doctor (Ullrich?) and the Audi pit team.
I heard Nigel was concussed hence the reason to be lifted out of the car, but he's OK now, and safely back at home with his money.
That race is awesome.
|
Aw Smokie! Not "awesome". You'll be saying "gutted" next. Check your baseball cap setting, it's not slipped round back to front has it?
:-)
JH
|
Disregarding who did or didn't win. I thought this was a cracking race.
Very exciting!
|
Best race of the year so far I think. Well worth watching all the way though.
Can see why Schu is looking to 2011.
|
>> Can see why Schu is looking to 2011.
He must be spitting mad; it provides a certain amount of entertainment ;-)
Brilliant? Definitely. A gentleman? Only when it's convenient.
|
Geat race from start to finish.
One thing that has always puzzled is the reference to drivers using the dirty side of the track on the slowing down lap to pick up tyre debri and make sure the car isn't too light at the weigh-in. Exactly how much weight can this add, I'd be thinking in terms of grams rather than kilos?
|
>> grams rather than kilos?
A good couple of kilos I believe.
Good race that, with the right result. Schumacher drove a bad-tempered race and deserved I thought at least two red cards. I wasn't at all thrilled by the idea of his comeback. I was right.
|
|
yes they pick up a least a kilo per tyre.
|
>> Good race that, with the right result. Schumacher drove a bad-tempered race and
yeah, bad tempered just about sums him up this race.
|
I agree AC. I can't give any support to someone who is not a sportsman.
JH
|
>> >> Can see why Schu is looking to 2011.
>>
>> He must be spitting mad; it provides a certain amount of entertainment ;-)
>>
>> Brilliant? Definitely. A gentleman? Only when it's convenient.
the only thing he is looking forward to 2011 is retirement
He wont be here next year
|
Z, "He wont be here next year" I agree with that too. Funny how the car works better for Keke's young lad.
JH
|
That's the first time I've been able to catch the BBC coverage. They don't transmit as far as me but they do have race coverage on their news site on SKY 503 page 3001 so I was chuffed to bits to be able to watch with the wonderful wise old Brundle punditing.
Who's the young guy with the quiffed hair who seems to be in charge? He seems quite slick but in the post-race discussions he kept flicking through his phone looking for viewer emails. I can't tell you how irritating I found this. I can't stand it when someone in my company is flicking through their phone but to have a presenter do this when he ought to be reading an autocue... This seems to be a growing trend. Makes me want to throw things at them.
|
Well thats modern communications for you.
perhaps you may consider a change of Handle?
Senile Old Dave?
|
No I'm all for smart phones and using them while driving and ipods and ipads and lord knows what...
But if you're supposed to be engaging me, whether chatting in a pub or presenting to me, don't start flicking through your mobile. It crosses a line. If you were interviewing a guy for a job and he whipped his phone out mid-way and held his hand up to your face...
|
They key is the name of the after race show.
The BBC F1 Forum. Part of the brief of the show is for the fans to ask questions.
They are stuck int he pit lane for gawds sake, how else do you expect questions to get to them.
Its not a job interview.
|
|
I'll tell you where to stick your cue, auto or otherwise.
|
And here we have an email from Zero, for you Martin,
He says "who is the biggest richard head, BBD or Eddie Jordan"
Martin: "Oh BBD without a doubt"
Last edited by: Zero on Sun 13 Jun 10 at 21:46
|
|
I am a richard head but at least I don't have a goatie and an irish accent
|
>> I am a richard head but at least I don't have a goatie and an
>> irish accent
For you, it would be an improvement, It really would.
|
|
Oi dave you miserable pole. Did you press the grumpy face button?
|
"Oi dave you miserable pole. Did you press the grumpy face button?"
I did not! I must have a secret admirer...
|
|
I just pressed the thumbs up - but only to see if it would work. Sometimes I'm not allowed to, why's that?
|
>> I just pressed the thumbs up - but only to see if it would work.
>> Sometimes I'm not allowed to, why's that?
Not logged in? It should tell you that if you hover over it with your mouse.
|
>> at least I don't have a goatie and an irish accent
Oh yes... speaking of goatees, haven't our two F1 matinee idols both grown one, or has Button shaved his off already? I do like his tattoo though.
|
I want presenters to look into my eyes.
I imagine it's how a large breasted woman feels* when a guy stares at her breasts and not into her eyes.
* yes, large breasted women feel great, I realise that as soon as I wrote it.
|
>> large breasted women feel great,
Not necessarily BBD. As elsewhere, size really isn't everything. Those who think it is haven't, er, matured yet.
|
To compare how Schumi did against Rosberg, use the following interactive charts. Untick all the drivers except Schumi and Rosberg from the list.
race chart shows gap to race leader lap by lap.
www.f1fanatic.co.uk/charts/201008r.html
It shows that Schumi's tyres went off at lap 51. Until then, he was 17 seconds behind Rosberg which amounts to less than the time taken up for his enfoced 3rd pit stop at lap 32.
lap chart shows time for each lap
www.f1fanatic.co.uk/charts/201008rl.html
|
To compare how Schumi did against Rosberg, look at the F1 standings;
6 Nico Rosberg German Mercedes GP 74
7 Robert Kubica Polish Renault 73
8 Felipe Massa Brazilian Ferrari 67
9 Michael Schumacher German Mercedes GP 34
JH
|
Beat me to it.... they are banning the clever Mclaren F-Duct but allowing adjustable wings next year anyway. Might make an even better season.
Also clarifying with immediate effect the overtaking rule with a safety car on the last lap.... discussed so many times on here before.... so not again please. ;-)
|
"... the device would allow a following car to increase its speed by 15km/h (about 9.3mph) and the driver in the car in front would not be allowed to deploy the device to defend his position"
Seems an odd bit of logic, consistently giving a very distinct advantage to the car behind. And how would that get enforced? If a driver always turns off the final bend into the straight and flattens the flaps (which surely they will?), is he not allowed to do that if there is a car within x metres of him?
|
>> Seems an odd bit of logic, consistently giving a very distinct advantage to the car
>> behind. And how would that get enforced? If a driver always turns off the final
>> bend into the straight and flattens the flaps (which surely they will?), is he not
>> allowed to do that if there is a car within x metres of him?
>>
You asked how it would get enforced. The detail is at the FIA website. It is all going to be done automatically by the FIA race control. "The driver may only activate the adjustable bodywork in the race when he has been notified via the control electronics that it is enabled. It will only be enabled if the driver is less than one second behind another at any of the pre-determined positions around each circuit. The system will be disabled the first time the driver uses the brakes after the system has been activated. The FIA may, after consulting all the competitors, adjust the time proximity in order to ensure the purpose of the adjustable bodywork is met."
Last edited by: John H on Thu 24 Jun 10 at 08:30
|
|
It all seems so 'artificial' :(
|
Oh fabulous. For 2012 lets remove control of the throttle from the driver, with the aim of having the driver removed by 2013.
This is the biggest load of merde I have even seen in my life. What are they thinking - madness.
|
Oh no. Why not just put indicators on them and be done with it. "I flashed my indicators so you have to move over and let me through". What a nonsense. As is the moveable wing. If everyone has it you're back where you started.
JH
|
>> nonsense. As is the moveable wing. If everyone has it you're back where you started.
>>
Everyone won't have it. The FIA control will activate it only for a car2 following 1 second behind car1, and only in certain parts of the track. Once car2 has passed and or braked, it loses its control of the wing, and if car1 is now within 1 second it gets its wing activated to regain position. So the ding dong ding dong can atrtificially continue lap after lap.
>> This is the biggest load of merde I have even seen in my life. What
>> are they thinking - madness.
>>
Zero, you can tell them so in person if you hurry
www.jamesallenonf1.com/2010/06/fans-get-a-chance-to-talk-to-the-sport-face-to-face/
|
Have they heard of Scalextric? :-(
JH
|
Monaco - Manatee
