I've probably mentioned this before, but I guess I've mentioned most things before so feel free to ignore the following !
Anyway, today, I was driving "her" Qashqai. It's the cooking model with a manual gearbox and a somewhat asthmatic 1.6 petrol engine.
I normally drive a much more powerful, automatic, rwd and much more toy laden Mercedes.
Funny thing is, and I can't really say why, but I feel much happier driving the basic car. It's pig slow, doesn't handle all that well ( especially with three mountain bikes on the roof ) and becomes quite raucous when nearing the national speed limit.
But somehow it's fun. If you want to overtake something you really have to plan ahead. If you get the revs right it'll go ok. Corners have to be approached with care, overcook it and it just runs wide, the car doesn't do anything automatically. You still have to decide for yourself if it's raining or dark or when to dip your headlights. I like that.
It's pleasing in short. Like fish and chips. Better than Foie Gras any day.
Or am I an automotive peasant?
:-)
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No, you're a Driver.
Real men drive unstable sheds, it keeps one young.
Last edited by: Robin Regal on Sun 31 Mar 13 at 18:55
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Not a peasant - although there will be plenty of people along in a moment unable to resist saying you are!
It's a matter of enjoying driving for its own sake, which some manufacturers understand needs to be built into the design of a car. Ford get it - that's why you loved your Mondeo. Vauxhall just supply machines to fleets for people to get from A to B in. Mercedes - I think maybe they're *too* comprehensively engineered - too sanitised, rather like seedless raspberry jam. Give me jam with bits in any day.
If your boss continues to value you, try for a 5-series Touring when the Mercedes comes up for renewal.
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Aye, maybe you're right !
There is something very nice about the Merc though if you've just got off a late flight and have a couple of hundred miles to do in the wee small hours before reaching your bed mind.
"Cosseting" describes it best in those circs maybe.
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Peasant.
Ive owned plenty of low powered cars in my time, and they do tend to concentrate the senses in all manner of circumstances.
However, having lots of oomph under your right foot is far far preferable. In my humble it equally concentrates the mond cos with the correct anticipation/gear you can progress past lesser mortals in a shorter distance, which no amount of anticipation in a cashcow would allow.
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>> I've probably mentioned this before,
Yes, frequently. I think its just to keep reminding us you have a GLEC.
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I prefer the Mercedes, Humph. I'd rather have the power there for when I need it, than have to faff about champing at the bit for the right opportunity to overtake.
The particular model that you have, IIRC, has excellent mid-range punch (it is the E250, isn''t it?). Effortless.
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Last year I took the Triumph Sprint in for a service. They gave me a new style Bonneville as a loan bike. Very basic retro machine. Not very quick; but do you know, it was a hoot to ride.
Last edited by: Fullchat on Mon 1 Apr 13 at 00:20
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>> Last year I took the Triumph Sprint in for a service. They gave me a
>> new style Bonneville as a loan bike. Very basic retro machine. Not very quick; but
>> do you know, it was a hoot to ride.
>>
A few tears back I took a CB500 in for it's first service and was dismayed to find the loan bike they promised me was a CB125. It actually turned out to be a great deal of fun, easily fast enough for the prevailing 40 and 50 limits and the slim profile and light weight made traffic riding a joy.
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Yeah RR - I like 125s for back lane riding - I went to France/Belgium with a friend - he rode his little commuter Chinese 125 me on the GS - highly frustrating - he admitted that it was a struggle in the UK on A class roads - and felt very vulnerable. A return trip has not been broached.
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Speaking of such things Rob, what's the latest gen on the scooter? I've got a couple of handy accessories you could have for it if you want? No charge in this case.
The first is a small can of Paraffin and the second is a box of matches...
:-)
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Big space in the garage - need to get it back on the road in case we get some decent weather though. Been out on the GS and the Kwaker a couple of times since. No PTSD to speak of
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>> Yeah RR - I like 125s for back lane riding - I went to France/Belgium
>> with a friend - he rode his little commuter Chinese 125 me on the GS
>> - highly frustrating - he admitted that it was a struggle in the UK on
>> A class roads - and felt very vulnerable. A return trip has not been broached.
>>
One of the greatest shames in recent years has been the demise of the 250 - 400 classes in this country due to learner and new rider restrictions. These bikes had from adequate to outstanding performance and were very affordable to buy and run. The nicest bike I ever owned was a Honda Bros 400 V twin, a grey import from Japan as they were never imported here. I only got rid of it because the pillion was a bit cramped for Mrs RR.
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250s and 500s making a big comeback - due to further changes - some really good offerings from the Japanese makers - there is talk that Triumph might be making an entry level..Tiger Cub is the moniker being banded about, built in Brazil. Triumph is a huge British success story....nobody talks about the death of the industry any more.
Last edited by: R.P. on Mon 1 Apr 13 at 20:34
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Test in one of the monthlies on the CB and CBR500s - modern take on the old twins - very good write ups - restricted to 46bhp...I had a sit on a Honda 500cc mini adventure style bike in the NEC last year. Eclipsed only by the excellent 650s and 800s from BMW as a future bike.
Last edited by: R.P. on Mon 1 Apr 13 at 20:44
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I had a '97 CB500 from new. In many ways the perfect bike, 125mph top whack it would cruise two-up all day at 90. Comfortable, bullet proof, a doddle to work on, great handling and 60mpg. If the world was restricted to only one motorcycle that would probably have fitted the bill, it had something to suit everyone and there was nothing not to like.
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>>I think its just to keep reminding us you have a GLEC.
Aye maybe, although not intentionally, and to be fair, I only have a loan of the thing, it comes with a job and would disappear with it too. Nice to drive but it has never felt like it was "mine" really. Not complaining of course. Nice while it lasts.
I'd be happy with anything which fulfilled my practical needs and was pleasing to drive. Probably why I liked my Mondeo so much. It did that admirably and I'd go back to an updated one of those in a heartbeat if required.
I'm not entranced by badges but I am seduced by cars which are good at what they are supposed to do and feel right when they are doing it.
Last edited by: Humph D'Bout on Mon 1 Apr 13 at 09:52
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Its balancing the strengths and weaknesses of cars that make them enjoyable, if they have faults but a strength that can counterbalance that fault to an extent then exploiting those strengths makes the car at least interesting.
Outlander is similarly enjoyable, it doesn't shift like the old MB, but its limpet like grip full time 4WD and precise steering mean that you can cover poor or slippery ground quicker than you would with something faster, you don't want to lose momentum so you don't.
My son finds the same with the CRV, he can cover the bumpy roads on his commute far faster in that than he could either the Panda 100hp or the present S type Jag, the unquestioning slippery and pot cratered road grip and stability prove the point.
Theme developing?, maybe these soft roaders with their more compliant suspensions and usually proper tyres have brought back the fun chuckable element for the modern ruined road.
Followed a 13 plate Duster being driven swiftly t'other day by a woman, fast on roundabouts and back up to speed surprisingly quickly, silver painted steel wheels so a reasonably basic model, looked good in white.
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Modern cars are great for getting from A to B.
Just like putting a bottle of plonk in the fridge, and taking it out to fill your glass.
Older (and RWD! ) cars are there to be driven, and enjoyed, as in enjoying a magnum of bollenger, on ice at Claridge's.....
ie, similar result, but a lot more fun in getting there...
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Inclined to agree with you GB re soft roader feeling better on poor surfaces. We can only reach the main road from our house by driving down a really knackered pot hole strewn lane and I have to take that very gingerly in the low slung estate but in the Nissan I'm more relaxed. Also, when we visit some of our mountain biking venues it often involves a half mile or so of unmade muddy track to reach a parking area so again the Qq seems happier on that sort of surface.
Deep down though, I suspect it's more of a sociological failing on my part. The Merc makes me feel like I'm at work whereas the Nissan makes me feel like I'm on holiday.
Not that I've worn a tie for work for decades but I do recall a similar feeling from the days when I did. Taking the thing off after work made you look scruffier but feel better.
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>> Deep down though, I suspect it's more of a sociological failing on my part. The
>> Merc makes me feel like I'm at work whereas the Nissan makes me feel like
>> I'm on holiday.
There it is in a nutshell. You enjoy driving the Nissan because it feels like a change, if you drove it everyday for work you'd probably hanker after the Merc.
Anyone who enjoys driving likes to drive other cars just to feel the differences and adapt to that cars' particular feel on the road.
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Wonder if there's a frustration element these days more than even 20 years ago.
You Humph have a fast competent business car, on the right road it can cover the ground at a hell of a pace, handles well too i have no doubt.
Trouble is there's thousands of dawdlers and mimsers out there, some nay most of whom incapable of making normal progress (roundabout and junction lack of progress especially annoying), some of whom i'm sure intent on baulking the press on motorist through sheer bl'''y mindedness.
Most early morns i get a good fast drive to work in the early hours in my old MB, but the journey home though can be exceptionally frustrating due to mimsers and baulkers, incapable of overtaking themselves and getting the hump when others nip past the lot of them.
You can have 400hp on tap and still be unable to get moving at most times on our crowded roads, i wonder if annoyance and frustration increase on a par with available power.
Last edited by: gordonbennet on Mon 1 Apr 13 at 11:03
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Corax has the same views as myself.
I love driving different cars, especially when visiting friends abroad. Getting behind the wheel of their Toyota Tundra 4.7 V8 great wallowing pick up is part of the holiday, and the 2 hours a day scenic route driving to/from their local ski resort is very enjoyable. The Outback 2.5 auto and Scion Xd are also fun to drive, but in different ways.
Im hoping that one day they will splurge on a Cobra!
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>>wonder if annoyance and frustration increase on a par with available power.
Another good point well made GB. It is indeed easy, when you get in the zone of driving a more powerful vehicle, to forget that the guy in front may not be taking the chance to make what looks like a simple overtake because he hasn't actually got the bhp to feel confident to do so.
Having said that, if only he'd in turn drop back a bit to let those who do want to move up the line do so safely...
:-)
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>>>wonder if annoyance and frustration increase on a par with available power.
Not for me because if you are unable to use that power to assist moving forward then probably the conditions are not right for more speed.
>>>can have 400hp on tap and still be unable to get moving at most times on our crowded roads
I am so thankful I live in an area and travel at times where this is not an issue. My new "work" requires a set 48ml return run each Friday and Sunday. For variety I use a 24ml cruise out on motorway, parkways and by-pass at 80 indicated then a 24ml fen/country road return at... well a brisk pace. Traffic never an issue.
If you judge an area's desireability by house prices then less folks want to live here than London, the south, the cotswolds and many other busy areas. However having lived within this same 20ml radius for 30yrs+ the freedom from traffic pressures in daily life has been a massive plus.
Oh and I'm with Corax.... if a repmobile was the daily hack then a Mercedes at home for the weekend would be a pleasure.
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>> Trouble is there's thousands of dawdlers and mimsers out there, some nay most of whom
>> incapable of making normal progress (roundabout and junction lack of progress especially annoying), some of
>> whom i'm sure intent on baulking the press on motorist through sheer bl'''y mindedness.
I like to make progress at roundabouts - looking far ahead and entering fairly fast so that if someone does come hooning it around I'm going fast enough to keep out of their way. I'll cut across lanes too if necessary. It all adds to being smooth coming out of the corner without unsettling the car.
I'm not sure how many people there are who understand that keeping momentum through junctions and roundabouts will save them fuel rather than this brakes on, then accelerate, brakes on kind of driving.
I think a lot of people just don't enjoy driving (I know two young lads who have cars but don't have any interest in driving) - many are forced on to the road because of poor public transport, and they are out of their comfort zone. They will hold you up, but it's not really their fault. Early mornings and late at night is really the only way you can make progress, unlike you live somewhere like Northumberland :)
It's a real pleasure to be behind someone who maintains progress in this way - I find it so much more relaxing to drive.
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We are also in a more or less rural area but we do seem to have an awful lot of the "maintain 40 mph under all circumstances no matter what the conditions or prevailing speed limit is" brigade usually driving something small and Korean.
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''It's a real pleasure to be behind someone who maintains progress in this way - I find it so much more relaxing to drive.''
Isn't that the truth, always a pleasure to watch a competent (not aggressive) driver making fast smooth progress.
I can still see certain good overtakers from years past in my minds eye, without a touch of the brakes able to simply flow past slower cars as and when oncoming traffic allows.
Rarely see it now, not helped by an increasing number of those who have no intention capability or possibility of overtaking yet travel as close as possible to the vehicle in front...and i see too many attendants at the wheel of lorries doing this for my liking, gets all of us a bad name.
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I come up behind too many people who only speed up when entering a "speed restricted" area.
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Thankfully, most truck drivers are still pretty good at knowing what's going on around them. Doing them little courtesies like pulling over into lane 2 when you can see one needing to join a motorway you're already on usually gets a little blink of of the headlights in thanks when you slip past.
Also I've found that if you hang well back from them on an A road keeping a steady pace and safe distance ( enough so they can see you in their mirror ) but just ease over to the centre line without crossing it they'll still quite often help you past with a little flash of their nearside indicator when they can see it's safe to pass.
Most of them are quite good. Well, the ones in rhd cabs antway. I keep well away from the lhd ones especially at roundabouts.
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To be fair H the competent and aware car driver sticks out like a sore thumb, and any decent lorry driver is happy to make sensible room or assist someone who's going to get a move on sharpish like...mimsers and the blinkered hopelessly unaware frustrate all of us, how many times have any of us taken action to let someone out only to regret it instantly when their reactions prove to be on a 10 second delay.
The common courtesy you speak of, quick flash of the lights or wave out i was told off for on my annual assessment by the company trainer.
Apparently by assisting you i have taken part responsibility should something go wrong...see ClaimsRus have even spoiled those little courtesies that made driving pleasurable..i might have forgotten his advice though..;)
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Reminds me of the time I was driving a Chevy Matiz when it was donated to our charity to sell.
800cc of sheer nothing, had to rev the nuts off it to make it move, motorway slip roads were third gear to try and get up to speed for joining.
Brilliant fun, though wouldnt want to cruise on the motorway in it!
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Same when I had on loan a little 3 cylinder Mitsub Colt with one of those strange gearboxes,
manual I think they are called.
Luved it, didn't I, seemed weird when I eventually got back into the old duffermobile.
:)
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>>the old duffermobile.
Aye but if you go and get yourself a trendy wee jeepy thing you'll be right down there rockin' with the surfer dudes !
Could take years off you ! ( top tip though, bin the fleece, dead giveaway a fleece ...)
:-)
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>> top tip though, bin the fleece, dead giveaway a fleece<<
How did you know that! - it's a good one though ... Lowe Alpine.
I suppose I could always put a surfboard on the roof, just for effect, and Bic stickers on the rear window.
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...it's a good one though ... Lowe Alpine.
That may have been Humph's point - trying too hard. Have you considered Cotton Traders?
};---)
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Quechua is where it's at for the under 50s these days in terms of fleece.
;-)
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Careful, Bobby, you'll wake Stu. Come to that, the din of that Matiz is keeping the rest of us awake too.
Older (and RWD!) cars are there to be driven, and enjoyed...
Hmm. I find my FWD fish-and-chips (or dill-pickled-herring) car more fun to drive than my, erm, Zander-mit-Kartoffeln RWD job, although this may have something to do with combining comparable power and (crucially) a manual gearbox with 350kg less fish - I mean metal.
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>> Better than Foie Gras any day.
Whole, mousse, parfait or pâté?
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If I were you, L'escargot, I'd be the very last person prolonging a topic about French food.
:-)
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I've never enjoyed driving anything more than my 1982 (3?) Mk ii Polo - which was twenty-one years old at the time.
That said, settling into the comfy seats of my Honda Accord and pressing the cruise control button to do a constant 70 up a motorway is quite a different experience.
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Same here - I use the Fiesta for work now and again - keep the mileage down and reduce the fuel costs - two different experiences, non less pleasurable than the other but in totally different ways.
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Fish and Chips or Foie Gras? - Robin O'Reliant
