Now I know that I should know better and should not even need to ask but I'm having my own little crisis. The Ceed could really do with new shoes all round 25K and the rears are original and the front have been replaced once. The choice of weapon as fitted by Kia was/is the Michelin 225 X 45 X 17 HP Primacy. Vastly overtyred for a 1.6 diesel estate but they look the part.
I've been trawling t'internet and Asda are coming up with some good prices:
www.asdatyres.co.uk/order/select-tyres-and-savings (you may have to put in 225X45X17 ALL)
They run from a £55.10 Jinyu to a £215.48 Continental. Chinese tyres get some stick for poor performace particularly in the wet but I get the impression that a lot of these reviews are from the 'boy racer' fraternity who like to think they are driving on the edge.
My style of driving is now pretty sedate [note I said driving here not riding :)] but like anyone else may have to brake hard occasionally for the odd drama.
The Sailuns at £59.56 seem to get reasonable reviews and I really am tempted to give them a whirl to save some brass.
So what would you do? Please note I would not be asking this question about my bike tyres and on that note you may consider I've answered my own dilema.
Last edited by: Fullchat on Sat 2 Feb 13 at 11:28
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I'm amazed at the choice in that size, pages and pages of them on mytyres.
The choice of brands I've heard of starts around £75 + fitting. I might try the Barum, I've seen them fitted as original equipment on an Insignia IIRC. The MX5 has some on it and so far they are the least troublesome feature of the car!
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>> I might try the Barum, I've seen them fitted as original equipment on an Insignia IIRC. >> The MX5 has some on it and so far they are the least troublesome feature of the
>> car!
>>
Barum is a Continental brand I believe.
This may help with who makes what.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_tire_companies
Last edited by: Old Navy on Sat 2 Feb 13 at 12:50
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Interesting ON.
What sort of mileage are you getting out of your Ceed tyres?
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>> What sort of mileage are you getting out of your Ceed tyres?
>>
Similar to yours, I am at 36K miles and have bought two pairs of tyres, new ones to the rear.
That should provoke the people who know more about tyres than the tyre manufacturers. :-)
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>>
>> The Sailuns at £59.56 seem to get reasonable reviews and I really am tempted to
>> give them a whirl to save some brass.
What would I do? I would throw on a pair of Sail-ons "on" and see what they were like, and if they felt ok in the wet and dry I would then buy the other pair.
I have to say tho that it appears the CEED eats tyres, and at sizes far to big for it it. No car of that size and that performance needs tyres like that. Ludicrous.
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>> I have to say tho that it appears the CEED eats tyres,
Don't forget the Ceed handles like a Focus and can be driven enthusiastically unlike some obsolete Japanese cars. ;-)
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"...The Ceed could really do with new shoes all round 25K and the rears are original and the front have been replaced once..."
Are you saying you've done 25,000 miles and already replaced the front tyres, and you're a "sedate" driver? On mine (pro_ceed with 17"s) I changed the fronts at 29k (down to 3mm) - rears still going strong at 48K. Perhaps a thorough check of the tracking is in order?
Last edited by: lancara on Sat 2 Feb 13 at 12:39
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Trackings good, even wear across the tyre. What tyres is the Pro Ceed shod with? Petrol or diesel? My experience is that diesels tend to eat front tyres more due to the weight of the engine.
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A couple of years ago, when we were having front tyres changed on our Mazda 2, I was chatting to the tyre centre manager. He had one of the latest Mondeo diesels, and said that wore through front tyres every 8-10,000 miles.
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Our hire cars seem to go through fronts at around 15K. A variety of drivers, I suppose.
I get National to stick Barums on whenever we have a damaged or worn out cover. Seem a good compromise budget tyre at around £50 inc vat on the Fiesta sized cars.
Ted
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My old CMAX diesel would get through a a pairs of 18 inch front tyres every 8- 10,000 miles. Luckily it was a company car as they were around £130 each.
On my current diesel Octavia the 16 inch tyres last around 25K and cost £60 each. Tyres can make a big difference to running costs
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What do you use the car for mostly and who goes in it.
I'll only ever put decent tyres on my cars, because my family are usually in it and the extra 5%, 2%, 1% grip on that dodgy corner/emergency brake/emergency accelerate might well make the difference.
I also stick to the tyre the manufacturer recommended because they've spent millions working out which tyre has the best compromise. I realise the older the car/tyres get that is partially flawed thinking as the newer tyres and manufacturer's processes evolve...but nevertheless I feel their research is better than mine could be.
The only thing I did do was swap Pirelli P Zero's for Pirelli P6000's..because I didn't need/want the harsh ride and very high speed rating on a 2 litre diesel estate..however Jag do use/recommend the P6000 anyway.
You know all the above in any case...and just need a friendly nudge...;-)
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>>I also stick to the tyre the manufacturer recommended because they've spent millions working out which tyre has the best compromise
Probably a reasonably safe bet, but there may well be better and more suitable tyres available.
Part of the "compromise" you mention includes industry deals, part supply agreements, marketing, market perceptions, noise and fuel consumption and many other factors important to the manufacturer, but perhaps not to you.
So whilst the recommended tyre can be counted on to perform as the manufacturer wants, that does not mean that there are not more suitable alternatives depending on your priorities.
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>> >>I also stick to the tyre the manufacturer recommended because they've spent millions working out
>> which tyre has the best compromise
>>
>> Probably a reasonably safe bet, but there may well be better and more suitable tyres
>> available.
>>
Unless there's a specific reason to change, I like to swap like for like as you get used to whatever is fitted.
However one snag is that that tyre models change as often as car models do, so if you've got a car which is a more than a couple of years old there's a good chance you won't be able to get exactly the same tyre. I had to replace a tyre on my daughter's 2yr old Golf yesterday and the tyres it came with have been superseded.
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>
>> I also stick to the tyre the manufacturer recommended because they've spent millions working out
>> which tyre has the best compromise.
They only recommend and fit whatever the best deal they get at that time. The same car can come off the line with four different makes of tyre in a year. They don't spend millions testing and setting up cars to one make of tyre, they only test and specify to tyre size specifications.
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>>They don't spend millions testing and setting up cars to one make of tyre, they only test and specify to tyre size specifications.
That isn't true.
I'm not saying economic considerations don't apply - far from it. But, manufacturers do test and optimise their cars for specific tyres - usually at least two makes, to encourage some competition between rival suppliers, and reduce risk of a failure to supply.
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Really isnt the case, at least more than two. In fact they will and DO test and set up with every major maker. They could not afford to develop and test a range of cars for one or two specific makes of tyres. Its simply too economically risky not desirable and possible financial suicide.
Exceptions apply for exotica or special or unique features (that have a marketing edge)
Engineers dont rule car makers, marketeers and bean counters do.
Last edited by: Zero on Sat 2 Feb 13 at 17:10
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I put a set of "Singalongamax" or something on one of my Mondeos. At that time I was getting through 6 tyres a year due to mileage so I thought I'd try some cheapies. It was ok really with those on but it was definitely noisier and had worse wet grip. More or less they turned an excellent handling car into an ordinary handling car so it wasn't absolutely tragic and in my case it was only for a 6 month period.
However, the next and subsequent sets were "branded" tyres. Never really got too worried about which brand they had on them so long as I'd heard of them but for me anyway, the best of those were Pirellis and the worst were Goodyears.
The tyres on my Merc are Continentals. Different sizes at the front to the back and range between £230 and £260 each. That seems a lot for a diesel estate car doesn't it, but on the upside they seem to last 40,000 miles and more irrespective of which end of the car they're attached to so maybe they aren't expensive after all.
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>
>> car doesn't it, but on the upside they seem to last 40,000 miles and more
>> irrespective of which end of the car they're attached to so maybe they aren't expensive
>> after all.
Well if you will bimble around like an old fogey.....
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>>Never really got too worried about which brand they had on them so long as I'd heard of them
You, of all people, falling foul of brand marketing. How sad.
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>> The tyres on my Merc are Continentals. Different sizes at the front to the back
>> and range between £230 and £260 each. That seems a lot for a diesel estate
>> car doesn't it, but on the upside they seem to last 40,000 miles and more
>> irrespective of which end of the car they're attached to so maybe they aren't expensive
>> after all.
>>
40K for the rears on the Merc is amazing. I pretty well only use mine for long motorway cruising and get 25K (Michelin Primacy HPs). The fronts would probably have laste 60K if they'd worn evenly - I changed them at 40K ish, but only because the edges were a bit scrubbed.
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I'm clocking up miles at a somewhat slower rate than Humph; even so after 20k miles the rears tyres (also 18" continentals) are only down to 5mm so I reckon they'll be good for at least 30k miles. In stark contest the first set of front tyres on our A4, which were also 18" continentals, lasted just 9k miles. Subsequent Dunlops have at least managed around 12k miles consistently - its now up to 55kmiles!
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Another LEC here with an apparently modest appetite for rubber. Mine had about 6mm of sub-prime tread on it when we bought it 10,000 miles ago, and there's still about 4pm all round now, so it may be a while until I can give it the Michelins it deserves. It is, admittedly, not the kind of chariot that encourages hooning along bendy B-roads, but even so...
These are 225x16, incidentally, arguably smaller, and probably cheaper, than those on FC's Kia - on a car weighing 1.8 tonnes empty. And I could have had a 280 or maybe even a 320 with the same 225s.
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>> I'm not saying economic considerations don't apply - far from it. But, manufacturers do test
>> and optimise their cars for specific tyres - usually at least two makes, to encourage
>> some competition between rival suppliers, and reduce risk of a failure to supply.
I remember selling Fords in the early 90's, and you would see various makes of tyre fitted at the factory. Even different examples of the same models could have Bridgestone, Good Year, Pirelli or Dunlop rubber, depending I guess on build date.
I think I'd have cried if my shiny new car had been crippled with a set of Dunlops....
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>>you would see various makes of tyre fitted at the factory.
Yes - you do need to be a bit careful to be sure they were *exactly* the same model. For Vauxhalls, for example, the tyre book which was used in the dealer workshops which described the tyre fitments and required inflation pressures was far more detailed and included far more variants than the owners manual.
However, what I was getting at in my original point is that when developing a new or updated suspension, no maker can afford to develop it in conjunction with all the tyre makers on the market, so, typically the suppliers will be chosen at a very early stage of the development - typically within the first 6 months of a 42 month engineering programme.
Once the vehicle is in production, yes, other tyre manufacturers offerings can be and are tested on the vehicle to allow for factors like localisation, availability, and, of course, price.
Despite the lazy motoring journalism that describes accountants as being in control, it would be a bold manufacturer who fitted tyres, as safety critical parts, at the factory which had not passed the engineering acceptance tests for the vehicle.
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Same Michelins (made in Spain) as you mentioned in the OP - mine was a 2.0l petrol auto (not available in the UK market, I think) - could be right that the heavier diesel engine and increased torque leads to more wear. Whilst some of our roads here are in better condition - others are really bad.
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Strangely the second lot of Michelins on the front seemed to have lasted a good deal longer than the first.
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Some of you may recall (taking the mickey;) when i decided to experiment with such a change with the summer set on my old MB.
The Toyo T1R's fitted were getting increasingly noisier as was the hard crashing ride as they wore, however the grip was nothing short of fantastic, but i couldn't stand the noise/ride any more and swapped them @ 4mm for a set of Taiwanese jobbies.
After a lot of research for quiet running rubber i bought a set of (same size as yours FC) Federal Formoza FD2's for the princely sum of about £210 all in, a bargain.
They are indeed far quieter and the ride is now smooth again, no they do not grip as well as the Toyo's in the wet, i can provoke wet wheelspin which was difficult to do with the Toyos, but they are far from dangerous and i would buy again.
Just slightly more expensive than the cheapies i see Uniroyal Rain Sports lurking about in that size, almost universally recognized as an good all round choice as is the similar Rain Expert that serves the higher profile sizes, both noted for good wet grip, ISTR Z finding RE's particularly good.
Not surprising Mundano Diesels eat front tyres, having to rev the nuts off the thing to stop it stalling every time you pull away is bound to have an effect.:)
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The front tyres on my Passat are getting low. Not at the legal limit or close but worn down quite a bit. Will need replacing in a few months I hope. They are also Continental tyres as it happens and are 18" low profile (isn). If they end up replaced by the equivalent they should be Contiseal tyres.
And mileage is only 11,000. I don't think I'd get anywhere close to even 15k miles.
Lease company ought to replace them early IMO. They will have thought I'd do about 54k miles in three years. I will probably do half that.
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I have a 2008 Ceed diesel with 17" wheels. One of the front tyres got damaged.
Because my local trye fitters only had one of my preferred Kuhmo or Continental, I ended up with two Maxis on the front.
£80-£90 each. They have been on a year/20K. Wearing well and good grip.
Continental Sport Contact 3 (without looking) on the back
£120 each. 18 months/30K ago. Also wearing well.
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The ADAC (German RAC/AA) tests tyres; they happen to have tested 225/45x17 in 2010
www.adac.de/infotestrat/tests/reifen/sommerreifen/2010_Sommerreifen_Test_225_45_R17.aspx?
The headings relate to
Trocken - Dry
Nass - wet
Geraeusch/Komfort - noise/comfort
Kraftstoffverbrauch - fuel economy
Verschleiss - wear rate
The lower the score the better in each topic. Decide which are the more important areas for you then choose accordingly
Chinese tyres? Nein Danke, looking at these tests....
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In the latest Which? test on summer tyres in this size, the three Best Buys were Pirelli Cinturato P7 (score 69%), Goodyear Eagle F1 (67%), and Dunlop SP Sport Maxx TT (67%).
Michelin Pilot Sport 3 (63%) and Continental SportContact 3 (61%) came 4th and 5th - not scoring as well for braking in the wet and wear.
In contrast, the Nankang Noble Sport NS-20 scored 44%, and the Wanli S-1063 scored 10%.
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>> In contrast, the Nankang Noble Sport NS-20 scored 44%, and the Wanli S-1063 scored 10%.
Nankang? Wanli? even the names are enough to make you wary.
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and lets hope the two manufacturers don't merge....
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If all these far east sounding tyres are real ditch finders they should fitted to all EU minister Mercedes S class as test mules.
The problem for me is depending if the tyre has an E or an e indicates a different set of legislation; E being ECE Regulation 30, e being DIRECTIVE 92/23/EEC. Why do we need two ?
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>The problem for me is depending if the tyre has an E or an e indicates a different set of legislation..
The problem for me is that Goodyear Europe do not market the (OEM fit) Eagle F1 in the size fitted to one of my cars yet I can't have them shipped over from the US because they don't have an 'E' stamped on the sidewall.
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How does that sit with your insurance company ? OEM fit but non-compliance with euro rules.
Presumably this is a Mustang type vee-hickle in which case does it not have to be euro-ised to comply ? Amber indicators instead of blinking red brake lights etc...
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Insurance Co. don't care as long as the tyres are the same size and rating as OEM.
After some trial and error I now fit Kumho Ecsta.
>Presumably this is a Mustang type vee-hickle in which case does it not have to be euro-ised to comply ?
It's a Camaro Z28. Front sidelights are the biggest problem - the originals are housed behind the amber indicator lenses but MOT rules say that sidelights have to be white not amber.
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>> If all these far east sounding tyres are real ditch finders they should fitted to
>> all EU minister Mercedes S class as test mules.
>>
They'd be fine - Mercedes ESP is a real nanny. I tried to powerslide mine around a greasy roundabout and it turned the yellow light on and laughed at me.
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What the Minister or the Merc ? I suspect the Merc would be more difficult to unstuck than your Minister.
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>> The ADAC (German RAC/AA) tests tyres; they happen to have tested 225/45x17 in 2010
>>
Very good, informative post. Thank You.
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>> The front tyres on my Passat are getting low. Not at the legal limit or
>> close but worn down quite a bit. Will need replacing in a few months I
>> hope. They are also Continental tyres as it happens and are 18" low profile (isn).
>> If they end up replaced by the equivalent they should be Contiseal tyres.
>>
>> And mileage is only 11,000. I don't think I'd get anywhere close to even 15k
>> miles.
>>
>> Lease company ought to replace them early IMO. They will have thought I'd do about
>> 54k miles in three years. I will probably do half that.
>>
We (at least the company) used to be surcharged by the lease company if tyres lasted less than 30K miles.
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KIA Cee'd - Tyre Dilema - Oh not another tyre thread! - Lygonos
