Making progress up the old A1 yesterday evening - a 70mph dual carriageway with many short or tight sliproads.
As I approach one with two cars joining from a 30 limit I move out to give them space to join, three bikers come down the sliproad at speed
One undertakes the last car on the sliproad and cuts between him and the car infront
One cuts between me and the car on the sliproad
One goes straight round the back of me
I can live with that in urban stop go, but at the speeds they were travelling I barely had time to work out where any one of them was before they were gone.
What were they thinking ?
Were thehy thinking
When they end up as donors, pity the poor sod who gets their brains
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Sounds to me as if they surprised you a bit borasport and you reacted like an old woman as so many of us do when surprised.
From their point of view, by the sound of it from your description, your car and all the other cars involved might as well have been traffic cones, mimsing along at the limit or well below it. The bikes chose their three routes through these moving obstructions and were gone before any of you could manage a dangerous swerve or stab at the brakes. They were doing the sensible thing.
That's what it sounds like to me. But I see from your gongs that there are other old women here.
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I was taken by surprise by a biker today and SWMBO was even more surprised.
Guy on a big bike was so impatient to get on his way that he took to to the pavement some way back on my nearside. I did not see him coming. I was third in queue at some temp traffic lights on a minor road when my near side passenger window blacked out as he came by.
I have not seen this antic before and he must of saved 20 seconds at best - "brain dead ?!!!!). Another doner ?
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>> he must of saved 20 seconds at best
It's not the seconds, it's getting past cars that may later prove obstructive while they are stationary. Of course big bikes can overtake easily so that is less important for them than for cars.
Perhaps some of us might experiment with the same technique in our cars, and report back.
Look, someone surprising you while you're chewing the cud is one thing, but someone doing something dangerous is another. Neither you nor borasport described anything that sounded especially dangerous to me. I'm not saying it wasn't because I don't know. But it sounds pretty normal to me. All these bikers were doubtless being careful in their fashion. Never a mention of a wheelie even, and I have seen and applauded a good few of those on the public roads.
Frankly comrades, Yee-HAH! and so on, knowImean?
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>> Neither you nor borasport described anything that sounded especially dangerous to me.
I take it that you completely missed this bit then?
"...he took to to the pavement some way back...."
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There is no excuse for taking to the pavement, but as someone with both car and bike licenses, I can say that manoeuvres that can look hurried and dangerous from behind the wheel of a car, can be planned and executed perfectly safely by an observant biker.
In the case of the OP, the bikes were clear of his car, and he was therefore no danger to them, before he had time to register his surprise.
There are some complete idiots on bikes, I am not disputing that. But not everything that looks dangerous to a non-biker actually is dangerous.
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>> There are some complete idiots on bikes, I am not disputing that. But not everything
>> that looks dangerous to a non-biker actually is dangerous.
Same principle on a push bike. Mixing it with London traffic looks too dangerous even to be a sport but it's OK if you know what you're doing.
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>> >> There are some complete idiots on bikes, I am not disputing that. But not
>> everything
>> >> that looks dangerous to a non-biker actually is dangerous.
But what *is* dangerous is to surprise drivers who can take avoiding action thus causing an accident. Doing something that looks dangerous does not constitute defensive driving.
>> Same principle on a push bike. Mixing it with London traffic looks too dangerous even
>> to be a sport but it's OK if you know what you're doing.
yes... to a point. But many London cyclists have a death wish. Cycling round the Elephant & Castle roundabout is a quick way to death, and they know because they campaign about it... yet they still do it. Stupid.
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>> yes... to a point. But many London cyclists have a death wish. Cycling round the
>> Elephant & Castle roundabout is a quick way to death, and they know because they
>> campaign about it... yet they still do it. Stupid.
Don't know E&C but had a quick look on Google. Doesn't look as though it's trafic lit which means big hazard from traffic entering. Might be OK if you can maintain speed and visibilty and ensure eye contact but I'm glad it's not on my commute.
Have to tackle Parliament square a couple of times a month and now have my lanes/lines preplanned. Again it's OK if you keep visible; trying to creep round the outside is far more risky.
Oh and if anybody wants to mention red lights just watch how many buses and taxis going on round the square blatantly run the lights where Gt George St joins.
Mind you anybody round there yesterday when the GB volley ball girls were strutting their stuff yesterday would have been sore distracted ;-)
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Fri 25 May 12 at 12:22
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>> Sounds to me as if they surprised you a bit borasport and you reacted like
>> an old woman as so many of us do when surprised.
Mimsing at the limit is a bit of a contradiction in terms when the limit is 70 - I was doing an indicated 75, on the grounds that (a) I know from my Sat nav that means I'm doing seventy one and a bit, and (b) its not wiser to do much more with bike upright on the roof (believe me, I know)
And it is sweet of you to defend them, but it is precisely their action that is likely to shock some unnattentive teenager or slow responding grandad into 'a dangerous swerve or stab at the brakes', and when it does, whose going to come off worse ?
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I've been startled by bikers in similar circumstances.
A startled driver is a danger to himself and other road users.
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>> sweet of you to defend them,
Thank you borasport.
Sorry for implying that you were behaving like an old woman (lots of cool and competent old babes actually). But there are some here.
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chapeau, as somebody used to say........
I've no issue with bikers going out and giving it rice - where there's space to do it, but on this occasion I think they did the wrong thing at the wrong place, and it's always going to be high risk, especially for the biker.
I was on my way to my usual wednesday evening cycle ride (now that is mimsing - I whoop'n'holler if the speedo reaches double figures). It takes me along a lovely country lane, from Byram to Birkin - the last part of which is quite bendy, and an embankment on one side means you can't see far ahead. Last year a collection of flowers at the roadside and debris in the gutter marked the spot where a biker met a motorist, and neither of them had anywhere to go.............
www.yorkpress.co.uk/news/selby_tadcaster/9418113.Windscreen_crash_killed_Selby_biker/
Last edited by: borasport on Fri 25 May 12 at 16:53
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Sort of off-topic, but...
Today I had to do a lot of running about doing shopping, bill-paying etc etc etc, before coming in to work at lunchtime.
Fetched the sprogs from school, dropped them at home, and headed into town. Now, anyone who has ever seen a Cape storm will know what I'm talking about. Down the motorway (120km/h) speed limit, I was doing 75-80, because visibility ahead was pretty poor, to say the least.
Had all the lights on in the vehicle - Mitsu Shogun - and obviously from the higher driving position, could see pretty well ahead. Cars ahead were hitting pools of water which was unable to drain away quick enough, and sending up clouds of spray, so I hit the hazard lights a few times to warn those behind that there was ... hey! a hazard ahead!
However, some absolute muppets decided that they knew better, and can hammering past at silly speeds. Obviously they have radar or similar, so know exactly what's ahead.
10km down the road, there was a crumpled A3 against the barrier on a notorious flooding stretch.
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I don't think I've scared another driver often - I ride as defensively as I can, I filter occasionally when the need arises, and admit to bollard dodging on Britannia Bridge the other week on the way to work, but this was to avoid phoning, texting, shaving, hair brushing, make up applying, headphone wearing muppets that I'd witnessed during various commutes over the last few months - drivers are generally less switched on than riders - especially motorcyclists who want to stay alive. Done two bike courses and Advanced car course in the 80s. I think that if I'm armed with audacity and boldness is my friend steady and safe progress can be maintained. Plenty of "look at me" muppets on two wheels as well.
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Organ Donors - Armel Coussine
