After being a loyal TT fan for a number of years, I have come to the conclusion they are now rubbish.
The battery on nicoles TT 1 crapped out after 16 months, and now my TT XXL IQ routes classic has crapped out - White screen, do a reset and get the TT drums but still white screen. Its 5 months old.
TT - never again.
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I have used TT for years and currently use the TT app on my iPhone.
I think it's brilliant.
I pay extra for the HD traffic and use pocketworld GPS camera database with it.
Its never let me down.
Last edited by: a900ss on Wed 23 May 12 at 07:24
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>> I have used TT for years and currently use the TT app on my iPhone.
>>
>>
>> I think it's brilliant.
>>
>> I pay extra for the HD traffic and use pocketworld GPS camera database with it.
>>
>>
>> Its never let me down.
Only because tomtom don't make the iPhone or specify the base OS
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>> After being a loyal TT fan for a number of years, I have come to
>> the conclusion they are now rubbish.
>>
+1 (Similar battery problems to yours.)
>> TT - never again.
+1
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I (and millions of others) don't have a problem with TT products, must be operator error. :-)
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>> I (and millions of others) don't have a problem with TT products, must be operator
>> error. :-)
You lie you had to change the battery on yours
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>> >> I (and millions of others) don't have a problem with TT products, must be
>> operator
>> >> error. :-)
>> You lie you had to change the battery on yours
>>
I don't consider that a problem, batteries are a consumable.
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>> >> >> I (and millions of others) don't have a problem with TT products, must
>> be
>> >> operator
>> >> >> error. :-)
>> >> You lie you had to change the battery on yours
>> >>
>>
>> I don't consider that a problem, batteries are a consumable.
If that were the case they would have made it changeable by the user
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>> >> I don't consider that a problem, batteries are a consumable.
>> If that were the case they would have made it changeable by the user
>>
They are, it can't be difficult if I can do it.
Last edited by: Old Navy on Wed 23 May 12 at 13:33
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Removing labels, using special tools and researching it on the net is NOT user changeable.
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Quite right. One out, one in - no messing about!
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Wife's TT1 battery quickly drains (minutes) and id so from a few months old. I assumed this was just because it has been used all the time plugged in and just accepted it as a fact of life.
My equivalent Garmin doesn't have this problem. The routes are rubbish though. Frequently tries to take me off a motorway and round the junction and back on again, if it thinks there is slow traffic on the motorway. It has no idea whether there is a delay at the junction itself, but seems to assume there isn't and attempts to route around half a mile of "delay" on the motorway.
There's no 'good compromise' route option with it either - 'shortest' is ridiculous, 'fastest' can be miles longer for a two minute improvement, and 'easy' can take you miles out of your way to save going through a small town or a few road junctions. Cambridge to Houghton is an example that springs to mind - g.co/maps/t28k5 - the Garmin takes you to J23 on the A14, the far side of Huntingdon, an extra 5 miles at least on a 17 mile journey.
In short, we'll often trust the TT but always use the Garmin in conjunction with a map. I still prefer TT by far for routes.
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My TT820 is great - the HD traffic and IQ routes genuinely work well though can't comment on the battery as I leave it plugged in all the time.
It's slooooow though when compared to Google Maps Navigation on my phone, and the screen refresh could be faster, as could the time to GPS fix.
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Haven't used any bespoke sat nav since I discovered Google Maps Navigation on Android. It's brilliant.
We do have an old Garmin which will be pressed into service for the run down to Italy in the summer.
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Had an "enforced" change with a built-in TomTom in a new car this year after many years wiith Garmin. After 5 months I'd call it a draw:
For TomTom:
Better routes
Mapshare/Map corrections
For Garmin:
Better inferface
Integration with Mapsource for route planning
Tracklogs
More comprehensive POI database
Equal:
Usefulness of Traffic debatable
Currency of maps
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Sat navs are the motoring equivalent of the toasted sandwich maker.
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>> Sat navs are the motoring equivalent of the toasted sandwich maker.
>>
>>
>>
Sorry, we couldn't all afford to get a brand new car with a satnav built in.
Last edited by: Fursty Ferret on Wed 23 May 12 at 12:06
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...we couldn't all afford to get a brand new car with a satnav built in...
Even worse, at least sandwich makers aren't fitted in kitchens so you can hide the stupid thing at the back of a cupboard.
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>> Sat navs are the motoring equivalent of the toasted sandwich maker.
>>
>>
Sounds like the basis of daily mail story to me
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With a thread title like this can we expect Tom Tom's software to be monitoring this forum and pass on his displeasure at their product?
Should have an email from them soon Z.
Pat
Last edited by: pda on Wed 23 May 12 at 12:34
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Oh good I can hysterically blame everyone on the site then
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For balance, I had a TomTom One XL three or four years ago. I hardly ever used it but it seemed OK when I did.
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I have to say I've never liked TomToms. Never got on with the user interface on them. I have a Navigon which just seems much more intuitive to use. Also got Navigon software on the iPhone.
TomToms are fitted as the SatNav option to Renaults these days. I went through a phase a while back of being given Renaults as rental cars. The combination of TomTom user interface and the unfathomable Renault ergonomics to use it frequently saw me reach for my iPhone as a navigation guide.
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If you patiently work your way through TomTom's online support they'll usually sort it out for you.
I got a bit stuck recently but an email to their CEO (which of course he wouldn't read himself) soon generated a positive customer service response.
I resolved to buy another from Costco as they effectively guarantee them for ever, but on my last trip I noticed all trace of them had gone. Wonder if they had a lot of returns?
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Its a hardware issue, it needs to go back, it will take up to 4 weeks to resolve. So they can sort It out, fine, but 4 weeks is no good to me I need it for a European trip.
The time I need it most it's unavailble and they can't make it so
Nicole's previous one crapped out unacceptably early, her replacement has a rubbish mount and had a bad software glitch that took a week for a fix, and my recent one has crapped out terminally after 6 months.
Now you can all say " oh my 6 year old one is fine" so was mine but i can reliably assert that their more recent efforts are unacceptably bad. 3 out of 3 is enough for me.
Last edited by: Zero on Wed 23 May 12 at 14:18
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>> Its a hardware issue, it needs to go back, it will take up to 4
>> weeks to resolve. So they can sort It out, fine, but 4 weeks is no
>> good to me I need it for a European trip.
>>
In my experience (x2) once they agree to change it the whole process (they even send you a box to return it) takes just a few days. It's the time taken to get to the point where they agree which is a pain. However as one of yours is still in warranty that part should be quick - my returns were both outside normal warranty, but they still replaced the unit FOC.
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Not long ago someone offered to lend me their TomTom when I had to find a place. But I decided tried and trusted methods would work all right for me, and so it proved. So I have still never used a satnav.
I'm not saying some people might not find them useful sometimes. But no one can find our house by using one because there's a Google glitch that misdirects them. They still have to fine-tune by mobile.
I still shudder at the memory of the Chinese limo driver a few years ago who couldn't find the way from Shaftesbury Avenue to Savile Row without his nose glued to his satnav screen. Not to mention today's so-called minicab drivers whose lumbering people carriers mimse and veer about at random because their so-called drivers don't know where anything or anywhere is without peering into these badly-placed, too-small screens.
Like some other mod cons (the electronic calculator for example) they are widely abused and serve to make their users lazy, incompetent and well, decadent. I don't mind a bit of decadence and it would be hypocritical of me to condemn laziness, but these things are not to be encouraged in a context where they clearly make everything worse.
Last edited by: Armel Coussine on Wed 23 May 12 at 14:21
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Like AC I struggle to see the need.
I am however a creature of habit in my travels with a good grasp of geography and the road network. It also helps that Mrs B can read a map.
Famous case locally a few years ago where a cab firm were engaged to take Earl Spencer's daughter from Althorp, Northants to one of Chelsea's home fixtures.
Ended up at Stamford Bridge in Yorkshire, a place famous as the site of King Harold's triumph over a Viking army as a precursor to his own defeat by Willum Conker at Hastings.
But no footie stadium to be found by the Derwent!!
About twice as far as it shouild have been and in completely the opposite direction.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Wed 23 May 12 at 15:07
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>> Earl Spencer's daughter from Althorp, Northants to one of Chelsea's home fixtures.
>> Ended up at Stamford Bridge in Yorkshire
One can't help feeling that it was a bit blonde of young Lady Kitty not to notice anything amiss. I simply don't understand how people can sit smugly in a car without noticing what is spooling past its windows. Strikes me as virtually half-witted in fact.
I am a nightmare black cab passenger. Never hesitate to tell them they're taking the damn scenic route and I don't like it. Have to say they don't like it either, swindling carphounds.
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>> >> Earl Spencer's daughter from Althorp, Northants to one of Chelsea's home fixtures.
>>
>> >> Ended up at Stamford Bridge in Yorkshire
>>
>> One can't help feeling that it was a bit blonde of young Lady Kitty not
>> to notice anything amiss.
Her last appearance in the papers here was for being involved in an 3AM dust-up at the local 24-hr McDs after a night on the Pimms.
And in total agreement on the Satnav story. yes, my phone has it. How often have I used it in 2 years? probably twice, and that was because I was too lazy to get the A-Z (local version) from the car, whilst sitting elsewhere.
I can read a map quite well, i think, and if the sun is about, can tell my Norths from my Souths.
We're breeding a generation of muppets who don't have basic skills - calculators, digital watches, velcro shoe fasteners etc etc etc - by all means use them for convenience, but learn the basics first.
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"I can read a map quite well, i think, and if the sun is about, can tell my Norths from my Souths."
I like to think I can read a map quite well too but the problem is reading a map whilst you are driving.
Knowing your north from your south doen't help much when lost in the one way system of a large city. Unless you have a passenger who can read a map that situation rapidly becomes a nightmare. Nowhere to pull over to read the map and you haven't a clue which way to go. Satnavs aren't perfect but for me they take away one of the majors stresses of driving and allow me to concentrate on the actual driving rather than navigation. Right up there with the mobile phone as a life changing invention
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Totally agree there. But the point of my post was simple - idiots who don't have the common sense to determine that something may be wrong.
As mentioned, I rarely use my phone as a navigation tool. Cape town is pretty big and spralwing, but a quick glance at the map gives me a general area to head to, and an idea of where to turn off for specific roads. The times i've driven TomTom/Garmin/etc equipped cars where they've tried to send me on a route which i know NOT to be the quickest are numerous.
In the Althorp case, surely a basic grasp of geography would have told them (and the driver) that they were heading AWAY from London?
And that's the point - by all means use the technology when you have to, and when it is desirable to do so, but don't rely 100% on it, rather than actually read roadsigns.
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It is the people who are too thick to realise that a satnav is only an aid to navigation, just as maps and road signs are, that have the problems. They also don't seem to realise that a satnav can lie, as can out of date maps. They need to use some common sense and also a sense of direction. Obviously a mental challenge for some who have to drive, text, facetweet, chat on their phone, and smoke as well. :-)
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I lost faith in my TT Routes very shortly after buying it. I bought it as a toy just because I wanted to find out just what they were like.
But come what may, journeys with which I was familiar produced nonsensical routing, despite trying all the the alternative available i.e. Fastest/Quickest routes etc. Most times it told me to go on the most ridiculous circuitious routes often involving narrow country lane that I would not dream of using, apart from the time consideration.
This nonsense was OK in familiar areas but I presume the same would have happened had I been travelling in unknown areas, where my local knowledge couldn't be used or applied.
However, I can see they might have uses in urban areas for delivery/service personnel visiting many addresses where the 7 digit postal codes might enable them to find their destinations.
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I have no faith at all in satnavs since BMW satnav took me on this route
goo.gl/maps/xrZ6
instead of the perfectly good A387 and then Fore St.
We had to fold in both wing mirrors on a 3-series in order to squeeze through some bits.
goo.gl/maps/TMP7 goo.gl/maps/KuYj
Following this I have gone back to proper route planning.
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Mapmaker, I did that in a Vauxhall Cresta years ago on my first ever visit to Looe!
I think I've gone back almost every year since though so seeing the side that usual tourists never see did the trick for me;)
Good second hand book shop on the left near the bottom too!
Pat
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For any holiday destination you can't beat a set of Ordnance Survey maps of the area 1" to the mile, as I remember them. Mind you, you need a navigator person who can read maps and not someone who has to turn any map upside down to do so - my heart sinks when they do this.
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>> For any holiday destination you can't beat a set of Ordnance Survey maps of the
>> area
Absolutely. I have quite a good collection acquired over the last thirty years plus some forties/fifties editions from my late father and grandfather. The latter are only really of historical interest but are works of art printed on cloth. Any new destination involves at least three sheets; we're always on the edge!!
More recent are the 1:50k 'metric' one inch but I still prefer the old 1:63360 tourist map of the Lakes, with mountain heights in feet, for route planning and view appreciation. Somewhere I also have near full UK coverage of the Bartholomew’s half inch series favoured by touring cyclists until the eighties.
The Lad reckons I'm only waiting for him to go to Uni before taking over his room for the map library.
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I too buy OS maps of any destination I am going to. A tomtom can't give you the lay of the land, the history, the sights - all of which is available from an OS map.
I can even pick out the best route for the circumstances, scenic, fast, avoid areas etc.
The TomTom then becomes an aid memoir for this purpose, someone to read your notes for you - rather than do it yourself. Now, tell me, whats stupid or wrong with that - Whats to scoff at?
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When I am route planning I use the online satellite photos and streetview to see exactly where I want to go and then put the exact destination into the satnav. For example when touring the Jurassic coast I put in the location of the car parks where we wanted to stop not the town or village center. I do this when we are roaming around the country, it saves a lot of hassle when visiting an unfamiliar town, city, or area. If you don't tell the satnav exactly where you want to go don't blame the satnav.
Last edited by: Old Navy on Fri 25 May 12 at 11:12
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>> for you - rather than do it yourself. Now, tell me, whats stupid or wrong
>> with that - Whats to scoff at?
Absolutely nothing to scoff at. If it works for you then fine. Others find maps and tools such as google/bing OK. As ever, horses for courses/YMMV or whatever.
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>> Whats to scoff at?
Nothing. That sounds like proper use. One scoffs at uncritical dependence on these things. People who follow the satnav but never look (for example) at the name of the place they've just passed through, so they don't have a clue where they are or which way they are facing.
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it's a problem, isn't it, when you only trust something when you know it's doing the right thing. At which point, do you need it?
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last time I visited the Peak district I borrowed one of these.
www.amazon.co.uk/Satmap-Active-10-Plus-GPS/dp/B001WJNUHI/ref=sr_1_12?ie=UTF8&qid=1338023224&sr=8-12
Truly amazing - was actually quite anti walking GPS till I tried this. Not sure I can justify buying one but I'm working on it1
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>> Mind you, you need a navigator person who can read maps and not someone who has to turn any map upside down to do so - my heart sinks when they do this.
>>
Why?
Link thing
www.walkhighlands.co.uk/safety/setting-the-map.shtml
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Turning the map round to "set" the map is the first thing I do when checking my location when walking.
The good thing about a Sat Nav is that it automatically sets itself to align with the real world
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I would like a simple compass which works inside the car.
Bought a few over the years, none did.
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>> I would like a simple compass which works inside the car.
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>> Bought a few over the years, none did.
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I've always found it odd that we don't get that yet most hire cars I've had in the US have the compass point displayed either in the dash or in the mirror.
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America has vast deserts, you can get REALLY lost in the states. Over here you are never further than 10 miles away from civilisation.
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How reliable is a compass in a steel car? Compasses in ships are compensated by applying magnets to counteract the magnetic field of the ship.
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There is usually some way of "swinging the compass" in a car as well.
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>Over here you are never further than 10 miles away from civilisation.
You've never been to Basingstoke then Zero?
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>> >Over here you are never further than 10 miles away from civilisation.
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>> You've never been to Basingstoke then Zero?
Fortunately Farnham is within 10 miles of Basingstoke.
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>Fortunately Farnham is within 10 miles of Basingstoke.
Farnham is about 20 miles from Basingstoke!
And no-way could it be considered civilization.
Last edited by: Kevin on Sat 26 May 12 at 22:56
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>> >Fortunately Farnham is within 10 miles of Basingstoke.
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>> Farnham is over 20 miles from Basingstoke!
Blimey - your right - its 16 miles. That must please the peoples of Farnham.
>> And no-way could it be considered civilization.
Compared to Basingstoke? Even Reading is civilisation by that yardstick.
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i agree when i was shown how to map read one of the first things we were shown was 'orientate the map to the ground' less chance of making a mistake. Far from making your heart sink old git, you should be happy that's at least one thing they know and do correct.
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Well, when I was doing a lot of road rallies including nightime rallies in the late fifties, early sixties myself as navigator and others more expert than myself never resorted to turning their OS maps around. Just try to navigate a completely foreign rally stage with a 30mph average with your OS map back to front!
Last edited by: VxFan on Mon 4 Jun 12 at 01:57
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>> Just try to navigate a completely foreign rally stage
>> with a 30mph average with your OS map back to front!
>>
Or a ship.
Last edited by: VxFan on Mon 4 Jun 12 at 01:57
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Last ship I saw being steered, (at 30 plus knots) was steered by some bloke pulling waypoints about on a GPS chart.
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>> Last ship I saw being steered, (at 30 plus knots) was steered by some bloke
>> pulling waypoints about on a GPS chart.
>>
A bit more to it than that Z, easy to pull a waypoint onto a rock, a brilliant system until there is a power failure. A chart and pencil does not even need a battery, (even though your torch will). :-)
Last edited by: Old Navy on Sat 26 May 12 at 13:12
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...I don't doubt it, brilliant system until there is a power failure...
The offshore lifeboats use a GPS screen - there's one on the exposed bit up top (bridge?) and in the cabin.
But at the same time another crew member uses a chart and pencil.
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Or a ship.
Well there not much point when all you can see is sea. When walking setting the map will help you understand the landscape much more easily.
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>> Or a ship.
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>> Well there not much point when all you can see is sea.
>>
Never seen a ship in harbour or close inshore then?
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That's true, but navigating a ship is a totally different animal to working out where you are in a landscape.
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Agree, Old Git. "setting" a map is an excellent technique for people who are not very good at reading maps. Anybody with a good spatial awareness doesn't generally have to set their map.
There can be little more frustrating than your navigator turning a huge road atlas round and round in the passenger seat with each turn of the road.
I last set a map last week. Appearing out of a tube station in unknown country, with a multimap print off, and no sun to help with navigation, the fastest way to establish direction was to try alternative sets to the map. It is certainly a powerful tool, but as a general rule trying to read the words upside down isn't that helpful.
˙ǝlqnoɹʇ uı ǝɹɐ noʎ 'uʍop ǝpısdn ǝɹɐ dɐɯ puɐ ɹǝʇndɯoɔ ǝɥʇ uǝɥʍ
Last edited by: Mapmaker on Sat 26 May 12 at 20:15
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well rallying may have a different way of doing things as it's a rather unique situation but by and large map rotation is nothing to suggest a poor map reader. I've seen it practiced by plenty of chaps whose job it was to read maps.
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In orienteering, which after all is all about map reading skill,you are taught to always align the map with the features on the ground. The situation is a bit different in a car perhaps but if it helps the navigator I can't see the problem. The test is do they know where they are and which way are they going? If the answer is yes then they are doing the job.
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TomTom - rubbish - a900ss
