When I start my Mondeo it feels as though it's not blipping the throttle a little during starting as you'd expect. Instead of the engine firing straightaway with a little "rev" before dropping to idle, what happens is the starter motor spins it up to a touch below idle speed, making the engine kind of chunter into life over two or three seconds. If I let go of the key too soon the engine dies again, but it will always start immediately on the second attempt.
It starts as it should do if I switch on the ignition first and wait 4 seconds for all the warning lights to go out, but a common-rail diesel won't be using the glowplugs in this weather will it? (UK, between 10-25C) It won't let me use the accelerator to "help" it start either, as it's fly-by-wire and it doesn't enable the pedal until a couple of seconds after starting the engine.
Is there a solenoid or something that should be tweaking air or fuel settings during start-up, but isn't? It's only slightly annoying at the moment, but I like to nip these things in the bud.
Car had fully synth oil and all filters changed at 112.5k in March, now on 117.4k miles. Been using Millers for a couple of months in the fuel. Runs sweetly with loads of power/torque and 54mpg average. Burns no oil. No DPF.
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"It starts as it should do if I switch on the ignition first and wait 4 seconds for all the warning lights to go out, but a common-rail diesel won't be using the glowplugs in this weather will it?"
No maybe not but it might well be priming the fuel pump, some do it when you open the door, others at turn on.
Either way, yours sound like injector leak off, the rail loosing pressure through the injectors overnight.
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Thanks Zero, that would make sense. It doesn't just do it on cold starts though, but every time I stop even just for a minute.
I'd heard about the pump priming when you open the door on Focuses, that was an extra reason not to mis-fuel those. I'll just pretend I'm back in my K-reg Cavalier again with its epic glowplug timers.
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To be honest if it starts fine after 4 seconds of waiting then I'd just wait the 4 seconds.
I only use my Merc a couple of times a week so it's a bit more of an "occasion" when I do start it, but it's never occured to me to try before the glowplug lamp goes off.
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A quick search of t'net suggests I should drain or change the fuel filter - 5,000 miles since it was changed so I'll get the fitter at work to do it next time I see him.
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>> Thanks Zero, that would make sense. It doesn't just do it on cold starts though,
>> but every time I stop even just for a minute.
>>
>> I'd heard about the pump priming when you open the door on Focuses, that was
>> an extra reason not to mis-fuel those. I'll just pretend I'm back in my K-reg
>> Cavalier again with its epic glowplug timers.
Run some injector cleaner through it with an italian tune up.
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>> Run some injector cleaner through it with an italian tune up.
I suppose I do mimse about in it, will give that a go if I can find the space somewhere.
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Both the BMW diesels in our family start like that, so perhaps it's normal and the "blipping the throttle" was wrong?
Best way I can describe it is that the starter motor spins the engine up a bit and only then does it start injecting fuel, which does lead to a very smooth start.
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Update: The "wait 4 seconds for the pump to prime" technique seems to work fine, so I'll stick with that. Gave it an Italian tune-up of sorts on the way to work on Friday by not going above 4th gear so it hit 3500rpm at 75mph a few times - it seems to puff out a bit less black smoke now during an emergency go*.
*The opposite of an emergency stop :)
Last edited by: Dave_TDCi on Mon 11 Jul 11 at 15:30
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good lord man, thats not an italian tune up, thats not even get the Italian out of bed!
What are you red lined at 4900?
Get the car nice and warm, then find a slip road to a motorway, then shoot down there changing up at 4000 minimum every time. Then run it at 4000 for at least a minute.
When it puts out no smoke in an emergency go, then its clean. *
*note tho you will always see a haze in your rear view mirror at night highlighted by the lights of the guy behind when doing an emergency go.
Last edited by: Zero on Mon 11 Jul 11 at 15:36
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I'd add, hold it on the rev limiter for a few seconds to really clear it out. It's not like a petrol 'cut-out', just a mild 'I can't go any more'.
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>> good lord man, thats not an italian tune up, thats not even get the Italian out of bed!
Told you I mimse about in it. OK, I'll drive it like the works van for a bit next time :)
In my defence, I'm used to driving cars where something would break if you really gave it some beans. Whether the Escort had wheel bearing trouble, worn brake pads or a snapped spring, it was usually brought on or made worse by caning it.
If I permanently nurse this one along as though something's about to break, hopefully it should last forever.
Last edited by: Dave_TDCi on Mon 11 Jul 11 at 17:28
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When the CC3 - same engine - hits the rev limiter a little red upward arrow lights up on the dashboard as if to say: 'change up, you moron'.
The engine revs very freely for a diesel, so it's easy to hit the limiter in the lower gears.
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>> the CC3 - same engine
It's not, yours is the PSA DW10 belt-cam 136bhp one:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Duratorq_engine#2005_TDCi_.28PSA_DW_Based.29
Mine's the TDCi "Puma" chain-cam 130bhp one:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Duratorq_engine#ZSD_.28.22Puma.22.29
Doesn't yours have a DPF too?
No change-up light on mine. I gave it some coming out of Trowell services at lunchtime and it does indeed just reach 4800rpm ish and not go any higher. No fuss, no drama, still as smooth as a very smooth thing.
It was still a bit funny about starting later though :/
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...Doesn't yours have a DPF too?...
Does it? I hadn't noticed. :)
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Always waited for the glowplug light on mine, max 4 secs in the winter, perhaps less in the summer.
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Never had to a wait in mine. Even in the coldest winters when I had it from Oct 2003 - Oct 2007. Admittedly the previous winter in 2010/11 might have been different.
Glad to be getting heated seats though after last winter. And a heated windscreen again!
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My glowplug light goes out at the same moment as all the other warning lights, which leads me to suspect it's just testing the bulb in the dash and not actuating the glowplugs at all. My Octavia 10 years ago (is it really that long??) did the same thing, the glowplug light would only stay on (and the glowplugs actuate) when the engine was stone cold and the air temp was below freezing.
>> Admittedly the previous winter in 2010/11 might have been different
Last winter I had to turn the Escort round and park it half an inch from the wall of the house, as my driveway is quite exposed and its battery couldn't provide enough oomph to turn the engine against the resistance of the cold oil. I brought a 7.5 tonner home one night when it was -10C, took me an hour with a 3kw fan heater aimed at the sump to get it going the next morning.
Last edited by: Dave_TDCi on Wed 27 Jul 11 at 11:51
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I have heard it said common rail (and pump duse) diesels start up quickly without needing to wait ages for the glow plug light to out because:
1. The fuel is injected as a much finer spray
2. The glow plugs are actuated when you unlock the car - so the time it takes you to get in, belt up etc. is being used to warm them up
Last winter when it was well below freezing the Mazda6 I have started immediately.
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No doubt my Mondeo would have started before the light went out though the manual said let the light go out so I did.
The 123d does not have a glowplug light, I suspect they are actuated when you unlock.
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>> I have heard it said common rail (and pump duse) diesels start up quickly without
>> needing to wait ages for the glow plug light to out because:
My 105 PDs needed the glo plugs at anything under 10c. Start it without waiting for the light to go out would involve a very messy, noisy, spluttering smoky start!
Last edited by: Zero on Wed 27 Jul 11 at 22:43
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Ford Mondeo III - 05 2.0 TDCi unassertive starting - Zero
