Another issue with 'Enrico'.
After two weeks on the drive while i was on hols in August I thought the steering was a bit heavy. Eventually convinced myself it was just that I'd been using the other car and problem was simply one of reacclimatising to my own.
Then two weeks ago, after another rest on the drive while Mrs B and I were on a long weekend in the caravan, the problem returned with a vengeance. No doubt now; it was like driving a pre PAS car. Booked it into my usual garage (who pi**ed me off by not having the promised courtesy car) to be told it was 'probably' the rack/PAS gear. It was however improved on return, either checking/tweaking joints had eased it or exercising the rack from end to end had. A promised call back on prices for either a rack or, at my suggestion attention to joints, didn't materialise.
Today I took it for a second opinion from John's Motors at Fosters Booth, a place I think Mark knows. Dropped it at 08:30 and by 9:30 they'd called to say no fault found!! Possibly the pump losing effectiveness but they'd not got the kit to test it.
Went back mentally cursing the motor trade and all its parts. However when I drove off the steering was back to normal!!
So is it PAS, a dry/stiff joint or some other cause?
May be significant that trip to garage this morning was first time it's been on a wet road for three weeks.
|
I presume that the obvious of tyre pressures, belt tightness and fluid levels have been checked?
Do you have the opportunity to lift the front up and check for yourself any stiffness or looseness (is that a word?) on either of the front corners?
When turning the wheel, does it make any undue noise? Or feel rough? Or is it quiet, smooth but just hard work?
Does it feel at all different turning left or right?
I presume that PAS fluid needs changing like any other fluid? If so, has it been?
It does sound like a lack of pressure, and that can be the pump. But it could be simple also.
As for the place at Fosters Booth, I've always had good experiences there, and they've always seemed reasonably diligent.
Last edited by: No FM2R on Tue 6 Oct 15 at 12:37
|
That it hardens up after being stood is perhaps a clue. Xantias are prone to the bottom universal on the column seizing up - a good lubrication sorts this out(*). Strut top bearings are naff and easily seize - however, this is usually accompanied by a twanging noise as you turn the steering. Other than that you've got seized bottom ball joints or track rod ends or inner joints. If the rack or pump was going I would expect that the steering might be light if you turn it slowly, but loads up if you turn it fast or when not moving. I'd also expect the pump to be noisily complaining!
* when they do this you get a very odd feel to the steering - it sort of goes tight as you try and turn, and then releases a bit, but if you back it off it will be loose to where you had the wheel before. It's a most odd / disconcerting sensation, and nearly had me in the ditch a few times till I realised what was going on.
|
The steering on my Xsara used to get progressively heavier and "notchy" over time. Garage lubricated various bits of it which solved the problem for a year or two.
Also, what RichardW said next to his asterisk. Somewhat disconcerting on roundabouts.
|
Thanks for those replies guys.
Tyre pressures were an early check. O/S rear was a bit low and needs watching but obvs it's low front pressures that affect steering. Fluid level is fine, no pump/belt noise at any time. Nor is their any click/clunk etc between locks. At its worst if feels lumpy but still silent except for slight hiss of fluid moving(?).
Fluid, it uses same stuff as autoboxes, is to best of my knowledge original and SFAIK there's no recommendation to change on either age or miles. Stuff in reservoir is clear but smells a bit 'caramelised'. Probably no harm in replacing it.
Richard and FF's recollections of the effect of stiff UJ ring bells. I also think the original Xsara shared some history with 'lingo as follow on from ZX/306 line. For now I'm going to monitor and see how it goes.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Tue 6 Oct 15 at 14:24
|
|
Is it possibly a fault with the crankshaft pulley breaking up with loss of drive?
|
>> Is it possibly a fault with the crankshaft pulley breaking up with loss of drive?
Will check it but suspect that it would (a) make noise and (b) also affect the alternator.
|
>> FWIW
>>
>> www.gobluedevil.com/blog/need-power-steering-flush/
I came across that one last week while researching PAS issues. Seems to be US related if that makes a difference. While I'm not tempted by flushing pipetting out the reservoir, adding new fluid and rinse/repeat might be worth a punt.
|
>>Seems to be US related if that makes a difference
Only insofar as they are far more fanatical about fluids than the UK. Seemed like it made sense to me.
|
|
They seem to like doing an oil change every hundred yards.
|
Quick, easy and cheap though.
I used to use this one in San Mateo...
www.oilstopinc.com/sanmateo.html
Really easy. I cannot imagine the dealers like it though.
Last edited by: No FM2R on Tue 6 Oct 15 at 18:25
|
Could it be damp and/or oil on the drive belt? Gets removed as it slips and the belt then grips normally.
I would expect some noise under these circumstances.
You could simulate it by spraying some water on the belt and seeing if the results are the same.
|
|
Maybe the steering is fine but the old boy is just getting past it?
|
>> Maybe the steering is fine but the old boy is just getting past it?
Oy!!!
|
Better on a wet road... Have you checked the tracking?
I bought a car once with very strange steering weighting but (goodness knows how) perfectly even front tyre wear. The tracking was so far out it was visible.
|
>> Better on a wet road... Have you checked the tracking?
Better after a trip on a wet road rather than actually on it raising possibility of something drying out. I think the virtual pints go to Richard and FF or pointing the finger at the lower UJ in the steering column.
Now in process of trying to lubricate it with repeated applications of aerosol lithium grease.
|
Update.
Although there was some 'remission' after visit to local garage the problem continues to occur to point that on occasion steering is so stiff I'd regard it as a hazard. Restricted car to work/local use only and followed suggestion of booking it into main dealer - Richard Sanders in Northampton - where I took this morning.
Looks like jiggered bearing at top of n/s strut assembly.
Very impressed by how methodical the technician was. Disconnected track rods so rack and either hub assembly could be moved independently. That done he took me into workshop and showed that while o/s strut was moving smoothly as was the rack the n/s strut was stiff and notchy - even without any weight on it. Explained how they would repair and that while he cannot guarantee nothing else is wrong likelihood id there's nothing else but cannot be sure until joint is replaced and eliminated.
Back to Sanders on Tuesday for job to be done while I wait - 0.7hrs workshop time though I had to argue to stop them adding on cost of fitting new single use bolts.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Thu 12 Nov 15 at 13:11
|
Citroen Berlingo Multispace - 05 1.9 Heavy Steering. - No FM2R
