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As the title suggests, a place to discuss Formula One, and all other types of motorsport (excluding MotoGP, which has a section of its own).
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Last edited by: VxFan on Mon 15 Nov 10 at 01:05
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Good to see Donington back on the racing calendar, its a good track to watch racing on.
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>> Good to see Donington back on the racing calendar, its a good track to watch
>> racing on.
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And a Formula Ford win for Josh Hill, latest of the Hill dynasty to show some racing talent.
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Since his grandfather probably.
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Does that mean the museum is open again?
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the web site says so yes.
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Oh good, I must really try to go!
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>> Oh good, I must really try to go!
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Ex Lax or cod liver oil should do the trick ;-)
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So far no one has set up a moan about how boring the Singapore GP was. Could it have been interesting one wonders? Alonso winning from pole, Hamilton dnf... haven't a clue myself because there's no box here.
Can't help wondering whether to have a punt on Alonso for the championship this year. Something about the absence of twinkle in Jean Todt's eye in a strangely unconvincing interview about why Ferrari isn't bang to rights on team orders... Ferrari has been in the wilderness a year or two... but I'm not really a betting man.
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It's a poor track for entertainment IMO. Lewis's demise was the conclusion of a passing move on Webber. Webber had the inside, and Hamilton hadn't quite overhauled him when he turned in. The collision put him out, Webber survived.
Ferrari has a good car. To win both at Monza and Singapore, tracks of different colours entirely, is telling as Brundlo remarked.
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Lewis though Webber would yield, he didnt, bad mistake.
He didnt even do it well enough to take out Webber with him.
Bad mistake. Title gone, bye bye.
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>> Title gone, bye bye.
What could you mean Zero? Still in with a decent shout I'd have said, all other things being equal.
It's not over till the fat lady sings. Or in this case the thin slightly disagreeable-looking lady.
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Nope, he made the mistake once, he did it again, his mind is shot.
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...has set up a moan about how boring the Singapore GP was...
I fell asleep, as usual.
So to me, the GP was soporific, but not boring.
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Zero said:
>Nope, he made the mistake once, he did it again, his mind is shot.
Nah, the overtake was there. If he hadn't taken it I'd be wondering if he'd lost his marbles. You can't compete at that level if you refuse those opportunities.
It was just bad luck it ended the way it did. The usual outcome of a kiss like that is broken front suspension for other guy - like Hamilton suffered at Monza.
Tooslow said:
>Kubica!
One of the few highlights in a pretty boring race. IMHO of-course.
Good thinking by Kovalainen though, not to enter the pit lane with his arris getting warm.
Kevin...
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Championships are not won by DNF's in the run-up to the season finale.
You have to have an eye on the chance yes, but not at all costs.
True tho, Webber was lucky not to have a suspension part broken.
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I like the fact Hamilton has the balls to give it a go, regardless of outcome(although I'm sure his team has other ideas). There needs to be some overtaking opportunities. Change the track layouts or bring back variable boost turbo's!
Last edited by: corax on Sun 26 Sep 10 at 21:53
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Ive just watched it on i-player..
quote from Hamilton ' I really don't know what happened, I went in, I didn't see anyone beside me, the next thing I know my tyres blown, and thats it....'
He didn't know he was trying to overtake Webber?
Course he did.... that boy needs to learn to admit his mistakes, and learn by them, then he may win another championship...
I'm afraid I don't rate him, and I never will until he grows up!
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At the end of the day though, for Hamilton, he can throw away this season really because he is young, whereas Webber has to seize his chance before he is forever a 'nearly' man - he is getting on abit now and Im sure Kubica would love his seat along with a fair few others who have more years left in them.
Also worth noting that the MP isnt on the same level as Ferrari or RB so if Hamilton wants to weigh it up, he has done pretty well to stay in the mix.
Dull race really, needs something more.
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whereas Webber has to seize his chance before he is forever a 'nearly' man - he is getting on abit now and Im sure Kubica would love his seat along with a fair few others who have more years left in them.
Especially when Red Bull don't seem to be putting their full weight behind him, I think his time at RB is limited.
Hope he wins it.
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>> Hope he wins it.
I'd like to see it too. But I'd still punt on Alonso.
'I don't like it, Carruthers. They're getting restless.'
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>Championships are not won by DNF's in the run-up to the season finale.
Championships aren't won by refusing an overtake on the Championship leader either.
Hamilton was unlucky, nothing more nothing less. It's unfair to say that "his mind is shot".
>Hope he wins it.
So do I. Webber comes across as a decent down-to-earth chap who isn't getting the support he deserves.
Kevin...
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I'm gunning for Webber too. Seems like a top bloke.
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I think all these teams who have two "top class" drivers have to be very careful to not show bias to either driver. I think it was Christian Horner yesterday who said, after a long pause, he would show favour to Mark if he was winning - but with team orders not allowed I can;t see what they can do.
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"Good thinking by Kovalainen though, not to enter the pit lane with his arris getting warm."
I suspect his team were yelling at him on the radio, "don't you bring that back in here!"
My beef was with Schumacher punting Heidfeld off, mostly because I had selected H to make some progress in our office competition, but also because S would still rather barge people out of the way than drive properly. IMO, anyway.
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MS is making a dreadful prat of himself, its such an undignified way to remember one of the best F1 drivers ever.
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Oh yes. Keke's lad keeps whupping him so don't go blaming the car Micky. At least he got out of the way when he was lapped in Singapore. Miracles do happen.
John
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OK I should be proud that aScotsman has won this, but I have just watched some on TV during half time in the football.
Now, please enlighten me, but does this consist purely of cars going round and round an oval lap, like athletes on wheels? Is there anything else to it, are all tracks the same?
Looked incredibly boring!
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Oval Racing is not a motorsport which comes over very well on the 'box, Bobby... In the flesh, however, its a different kettle of fish... apart from anything else you can see the whole of the track and therefore all of the action, something impossible in circuit racing...
As for the skill level, well if driving in close proximity to upwards of 30 other cars, at 200mph+ and no run off is easy then....
As for all circuits being the same, no they aren't - they may look the same (an oval is an oval...) but there are many differences, size, banking, surface, etc.
There's a lot more to it than meets the eye... However if you want the ultimate in Oval racing then Sprint Cars on Shale tracks is where you should look...
But not on the TV...
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can you get an incense burner that runs on castrol r?
i could watch any motor sport on the box if you could
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If you find one BB can you let me know please, I'll put it on my Xmas Pressie list!
It reminds me so much of Leicester Speedway, Ray Wilson and Ivan Mauger.
Pat
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>> It reminds me so much of Leicester Speedway, Ray Wilson and Ivan Mauger.
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>> Pat
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Blimey, 1st Floyd, and now speedway!
Me, I was a Wembley Lion fan, just like my dad, and his dad before him!
I was @ the 81 World final... took the old man on the back of a motorbike..... ahhh those woz the dayz...!
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...speedway...
I remember John Noakes having a go at speedway on Blue Peter in the days of black and white telly.
It was one of the few action challenges he found difficult.
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I was at the world final at Wembley when Ole Olsen won it, but I can't remember what year that was. It was always Leicester on a Tuesday and Coventry Bees on a Saturday night:)
It was where my fetish for men in leather was born!
Pat
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'81 my dear, We were sat at one end of the stadium, with the start/finish to our right.
TV camera just behind us - I was on telly that day... well the back of my head!
After the Lions close, we used to travel a bit, don't remember going to Leicester, but did go to the other London teams a lot.
When I lived in the midlands a few years ago, the Bee's were my home team, and I went a fair bit.
In fact I know some of the people there, not the riders, but the 'back room boys', including a very important member of the team!
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The Bees were the better team by far, and all the Leicester supporters were embarrassed when Bostik sponsored Ray Wilson.
It was written across his bum on his new leathers but he still couldn't stay on the bike.
I was a Sales Rep in the 9 years leading up to that and one of my Customers was Dave Hallam who owned Supreme Motorcycles in Leicester.
He used to race a sidecar outfit and smuggled me into Mallory park one Wednesday afternoon for a practice session.
I borrowed his passengers leathers and helmet and did 12 laps in the chair.
Probably the scariest experience of my life, but by far the best one!
Pat
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>> ...speedway...
>> I remember John Noakes having a go at speedway on Blue Peter in the days
>> of black and white telly.
>> It was one of the few action challenges he found difficult.
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500cc, and no brakes... all good fun!
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>>It reminds me so much of Leicester Speedway, Ray Wilson and Ivan Mauger.
For me it was Halifax Dukes in the late 1960s - the two Erics, Boothroyd & Boocock, and Dave Younghusband were the stars. There's nothing like the smell.
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blimey i bought my first motorbike from ray wilsons shop (next to the co-op funeral place) 33 years ago.....its still a motorbike shop now
i think ray wilson lost his suzuki franchise when one of his mechanics put the wrong fork oil in a customers bike..whooops!
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>> i could watch any motor sport on the box
You can, but there are some better seen in real life... Watching a GP on the 'box allows you to see more of the race, but watching something like Oval Racing (car or bikes) or Drag Racing in real life gives you the atmosphere (smell, "feel", the crowd's reactions, etc) as well as the action on the track as in both cases you can see the whole thing... Watching either of them on the 'box just isn't as good.
That programme on F1 Stock Cars recently summed it up nicely... ok you can see some of the action on the 'box, but as one who used to go to the "World" championships back in the 70s and 80s I can assure you that it didn't have any of the atmosphere of the real thing!
Last edited by: hobby on Sun 3 Oct 10 at 19:11
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trust me hobby i do indeed like to be there but the incense wafting in the room with a nice big telly a large whisky and surround sound and a nice big bed in the next room is nearly as good
for interest i went to halifax speedway for years
hoddesden speedway
bradford speedway
skegness speedway
did i mention santa pod
Cadwell Park
sheffield speedway
and some others i forget
i was also into banger racing stock car racing
boy racing.............before it was nationalised
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I can live with watching the GPs or Saloon Car Racing on the box simply because I can then seeall the action... But I've never seen any Oval racing on the box that gets anywhere near the real thing and whilst I sometimes watch it all I can think about is what I'm missing (or missed!)...
Been to several of the tracks you mentioned and a couple of dozen others! ;-)
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>>can you get an incense burner that runs on castrol r?
And smear the hot bits with Gunk.
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Don't forget that you will need to get up early on Sunday to see the Japanese GP live. 06:00 start for the programme so I guess 07:00 for the race. It's too easy to get used to them being considerately run on European time :-)
John
Last edited by: VxFan on Thu 7 Oct 10 at 21:37
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"Ferrari's Fernando Alonso dubs himself the new title favourite as Red Bull's championship leader Mark Webber refuses to accept the tag ahead of Sunday's Japanese Grand Prix. "
So that is all sorted then :-)
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That sentence on its own could make Alonso look a little overconfident. Read the whole interview and its rather different.
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Infact here is what he said...
Q. How much more confident are you now, given that we are at a circuit that may suit Red Bull Racing?
FA: I think no surprises here. Red Bull Racing are favourites again. The characteristics are again very good for Red Bull but it does not mean that they will win the race very easily. We saw this year - some circuits that were good for Red Bull, it was not a 100 percent [certain] victory for them because normally always something happened. So we need to keep pushing them.
Of the four circuits remaining, maybe Suzuka is good for them – and then the other three are a little bit of an unknown – especially Korea. It will be tough. It will be difficult for us, but hopefully difficult for everybody else as well. There are five drivers with possibilities – McLaren will come back very strong, I am sure, pushing a lot in the remaining races. But it is still a very open fight.
Q. Do you consider yourself favourite, as you won the last two races and you have the power of Ferrari behind you? Does that help?
FA: I think if you see the last two races, yes, because you arrive in a good moment. It seems that you need to keep the momentum now for more races, but we saw this year that people that win two races, or have two or three podiums in a row, then they have some bad results and then they come back good. No-one had consistently six or seven races in a good level for different reasons, so we expect there will be difficult moments for us. What we need to do is be prepared for those moments, not panicking, and score as many points as possible at every race. We know sometimes it will be a podium, sometimes maybe a fifth position – it is in those moments when we need to be united and not panic.
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Vettel wins.
"Lotus are to use Red Bull Technology gearboxes" What's that about? Who actually makes those gearboxes?
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Decent race. I REALLY want to see Koby in a proper fast car, he has some serious nerve when overtaking. More please.
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Why do we have to have the race and two repeats during the day when Motogp - real racing- with Rossies' win doesn't get a look in.???
dvd
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Hear Hear dvd! Real racing with 4 overtakes per lap instead of 4 per race! You might find this an interesting Xmas present! Early copies are now worth £200, the price has gone up over the years but the write ups and photographs are outstanding
www.amazon.co.uk/Motocourse-2010-2011-Leading-Superbike/dp/1905334583/ref=sr_1_2?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1286717803&sr=1-2
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Vettel efficient. Webber even more efficient. Alonso lacklustre and efficient. Button unobtrusive and efficient. Best drives by Hamilton, overcoming penalty and ailments, and Kobayashi, outclassing his teammate and brooking no nonsense from tail-enders... the class of the field, those two.
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Suggestion - points for the driver who overtakes the most cars ON THE TRACK. i.e. Kobayashi this time.
John
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Brilliant race DVD and last week too:)
Pat
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Highlights on ITV4 now.
Just been watching Martin Brundle overtake everything in sight (Jags mostly) in an Austin A35. Proper 4 wheel drifts, proper overtaking, proper racing.
Last edited by: Alastairw on Sun 10 Oct 10 at 18:18
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news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/9118137.stm
Some of the boys are not happy. Bernie is so thats all right.
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Boys? This is men's sport. The boys drive go karts. :-)
John
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They can build what they like, but the "old" tracks are still the ones that excite.
Silverstone, Imola, Spa, and yes even Monaco. All the new tracks are witout spectacle excitement or theatre.
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Mostly designed by the same guy. I'd be willing to design a few. I was a whizz with Scalextric tracks. None of mine came out of the guidebook, I didn't have the parts :-)
A modest fee would be all that is required.
John
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Sorry if I missed it, but why is Coulthard in Woking?
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Supposedly showing how Mission Control in Maclaren works during a race, but the cameras weren't allowed in at the critical times during quallies. That facility must have cost a few bob, and the trophy cabinets were impressive...
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Renault - Unreliable on the road, unreliable on the track.
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>>Sorry if I missed it, but why is Coulthard in Woking?
Probably to keep him and Eddie apart. There seems to be some friction between the two.
He's also competing in the DTM series and maybe needed to be in Europe.
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Good race by Hamilton again and Kobayashi again. Was it Alguersari who crippled his own fron offside suspension hitting Kobayashi's front nearside wheel? Real bit of luck for Kobayashi. If the angle had been just a bit different...
No luck for the Red Bulls. Webber must be kicking himself and Vettel was let down bythe jalopy itself. That's life chaps. Button out of luck too. He's sensitive and didn't have the car quite right.
Ferrari seem to have found some speed pills. And a gritty drive by Alonso who is after all a proper champ. Funny look in Massa's eye after the race I thought. He too had done well. Just knackered perhaps, aftermath of the head injury last season.
On the whole the rain spoilt the race although not completely. Looked as if the circuit would be good in the dry.
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It seems that Hamilton dropped back from Alonso due to tyre degradation though was lucky that Massa was suffering from lack of vision in the dark due to his own steering wheel lights dazzling him, otherwise Hamilton might have been under pressure from Massa who's tyres were OK and was catching him before the light dropped.
Good race, Webber erred and Button was simply not on it, though I felt a little sorry for Vettel.
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That engine exploded with style and magnificence. It was hurling engine internals through the bottom that were sparking as they hit the track. I doubt there was much to examine, until the sweeper brought it back from the main straight.
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You'd have thought with today's technology my Sky+ box would have automatically carried on recording on BBC2 after F1 finished on BBC1. Not a chance. Thank goodness for BBC's iPlayer.
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How would the Sky+ box know you wanted to record that particular, unplanned F1 programme on BBC2? These recorders work of the known programmes on the TV guide and this change will have not been planned. If they worked the way you suggest, they would record a lot of programmes you do not want.
I was a little surprised the BBC put the race in two programmes on iPlayer - why not merge them?
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Yup, you cant blame the hardware, it only works on the information provided to it.
AND it took ages for Korea GP Part 2 to appear on Iplayer. It was a real PITA, I was watching it timeshifted by 90 minutes, and I knew I was in trouble with 30 minutes of my time slot left to go.
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I'm glad I didn't get up to watch it at 8am. I usually watch it timeshifted to speed forward any boring bits. I'd have got up to see them waiting to restart.
I didn't watch it until last night though (managed to avoid knowing the results). Glad it was on iPlayer too. The Sky+ recording would have been only the first part of the race.
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>> Yup, you cant blame the hardware, it only works on the information provided to it.
yes, but.
I happened to be up and about, but not watching the program as it was recording on my freesat humax, and the epg was modified before 09:30 for bbc2 to carry the continuing racing.
I know that because I scheduled the recording, and it recorded the remnant on BBC2.
The freesat humax appears to be quite dumb with its use of schedules. As far as I can tell, it sniffs the guide once at the time the reservation is made, and goes into standby to record 15 minutes before the time that was in the epg then - waiting for the trigger to start recording.
All that falls apart if the schedule is changed to bring the program on early by more than 15 minutes - that's one of the ways it produces the error "recording failed, reason unknown."
Also, It has no provision (that I am aware of) for series link across change of logical channel number.
It's nice box and all that, but a bit flawed - as all the PVR's appear to be to a greater or lesser extent.
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>How would the Sky+ box know you wanted to record that particular, unplanned F1 programme on BBC2?
Very easy.
Include an option to allow the user the choose "Follow programme - Y/N" in "Setup" and then transmit the followup info.
Kevin...
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My Humax switched over :-)
John
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I just hate to see that smug Spaniard on the rostrum.
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In the relatively long life of F1, I have only been watching it for two seasons, however, from my point of view 'it ain't much cop' and so after this season finishes, that'll be it for me.
I find it all rather over technical and non-sensical, to be honest although I realise that I must be in the minority. However, I am sure that there are some good spin offs from the sport that influence the cars we drive today.
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One of those accelerating qualifying sessions that are always so entertaining.
Early wild cards were Barichello (local of course) and Kobayashi while the track was still wet. But Kobayashi is learning restraint and control at the moment and ended where he usually does, at the front of the also-rans. But it was Barichello's teammate who appeared apparently out of nowhere with a quite gratuitous second pole-winning lap a second faster than the fast people. Naturally they were nice about it but they all looked a bit miffed to me. Tee hee.
Has Ferrari fallen off the pace in Brazil or is the team being cunning about race trim? We will see.
In the heat of the moment there is always a chance of someone putting their car in the wall on the long, sinuous, unlimited exit from the pit lane.
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www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-11704802
I'd be looking forward to the flight home tomorrow!
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Saw Andrew Marr this morning with Stirling Moss on as guest. He reckoned Vettel was the fastest driver out there. I think he's right. Vettel showed himself to be a little hot headed this year but when he's in a groove he's good, very good. I hope he matures and keeps getting better, if he had a more reliable car and better luck he would be in line to win the championship.
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The only thing that's stopped Vettel being world champ is Vettel.
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What we have had this year which is often rare, is we have had the top teams fielding two great drivers rather than a great one and a backup. This has allowed for better comparison between drivers I think.
I think Alonso has Massa beat hands down. Webber and Vettel, hard to say, ive not seen Vettels racecraft yet, so he may be a one trick pony, like a German version of Jenson in a way. Jenson Im afraid has been shown up by Lewis for the most part.
I suspect if Lewis had been in a Red Bull this year, he would have been crowned already frankly, same goes for Alonso. I dont like old bushy brows, but he is talented in a natural way like Lewis, whereas the others seem to need everything to go right before they can win.
A note on Scumacher. He seems to be starting to find something now. I hope he gets there next season and I think he might if the car is right. 2011 will be a fine season without a doubt.
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>> I suspect if Lewis had been in a Red Bull this year, he would have been crowned already
>> frankly, same goes for Alonso.
I agree.
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If Button could sort his qualifying out, he'd be laughing. His race pace was impressive when you think he ended up where Hamilton was, yet started 11th to Hamilton's 4th. Rosberg wasn't too shabby in that respect, either.
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Vettel v Webber, Vettel is no doubt the faster driver, they have both made errors this year though Vettel has also had more bad luck.
Button v Hamilton, very different types of driver, both have had their moments this year, combining Hamilton's aggression and raw speed with Button's smoothness and race craft and it would be awesome, kind of Alonso like.
Massa v Alonso, Alonso has been generally faster this year though remember Massa has Raikonnen beat on average over two seasons, he had a lot of bad luck in '07 when Raikonnen won the championship, was very unlucky not to win the title in '08 - and was simply lucky to be alive in '09.
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Unless I misheard, it was suggested in the post-race discussions that if Vettel is in front and Webber is in second place in the last few laps of the Abu Bhabi GP then Vettel might let Webber overtake so that he (Webber) could be world champion.
Last edited by: L'escargot on Mon 8 Nov 10 at 14:39
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I think you mis-heard. I think what was said was that if Webber were leading and Vettel were second, he might let Alonso past to win the championship. :-)
John
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BTCC - Zero
